I wanted to terminate two of my middle management and one supervisor. As per Sec. 2(s) of the I.D. Act, 1947, they cannot come under the purview of "workmen." According to me, they cannot raise a dispute under Sec. 2(k) of the said act.
Appropriate Forum for Redressal
Now, what is the appropriate forum for them to seek redressal? And what enactments help them to seek redressal? Can they get any remedy for their unwanted terminations?
Steps for Termination
Please provide inputs on what steps I need to take to remove them. It would be very helpful if all your suggestions are supported by appropriate judgments of High Courts or the Supreme Court.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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10Appropriate Forum for Redressal
Now, what is the appropriate forum for them to seek redressal? And what enactments help them to seek redressal? Can they get any remedy for their unwanted terminations?
Steps for Termination
Please provide inputs on what steps I need to take to remove them. It would be very helpful if all your suggestions are supported by appropriate judgments of High Courts or the Supreme Court.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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Dear Kesava, You have raised a query and quoted the provisions of the ID Act, 1947. However, what you have not mentioned is why you want to terminate these individuals. What is their misconduct? Are they underperforming? Have you issued any warning letters earlier? If yes, do you have records to support this?
Considerations for Termination
Since they are seniors, you may consider asking them to resign. However, proceed with caution on this matter as terminations are generally viewed negatively and can create a sense of fear among other staff members, leading to increased employee turnover. While it may not be illegal, it is essential to consider the organization's culture and management principles as well.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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Considerations for Termination
Since they are seniors, you may consider asking them to resign. However, proceed with caution on this matter as terminations are generally viewed negatively and can create a sense of fear among other staff members, leading to increased employee turnover. While it may not be illegal, it is essential to consider the organization's culture and management principles as well.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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In my view still they can seek redress all under Indian Contract Act. Provided they have signed and kept the necessary document.
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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I endorse the views of Dinesh, which are not only objective concerning the three cases mentioned but also conducive to the morale of the employees in the long run. There is a saying: "People don't leave organizations, but they leave managers." I think the very question has arisen only because of your inherent doubt about the justifiability of the proposed action.
In my understanding, the term "middle management" is a misnomer. In fact, the profile of middle-level managers is actually designed to be a buffer between the sources of authority and responsibility, and eventually, they get stuck in the hierarchy for long and hence become ineffective. If you are a unit head or an influential head of HR, try to think about other constructive and positive alternatives. Effective problem-solving always lies in one's ability to find out as many suitable alternatives as possible. Of course, it is equally true that only the wearer knows where the shoe pinches!
They have a civil remedy for damages if your orders of dismissal are arbitrary, vindictive, and against the principles of Natural Justice.
Regards
From India, Salem
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In my understanding, the term "middle management" is a misnomer. In fact, the profile of middle-level managers is actually designed to be a buffer between the sources of authority and responsibility, and eventually, they get stuck in the hierarchy for long and hence become ineffective. If you are a unit head or an influential head of HR, try to think about other constructive and positive alternatives. Effective problem-solving always lies in one's ability to find out as many suitable alternatives as possible. Of course, it is equally true that only the wearer knows where the shoe pinches!
They have a civil remedy for damages if your orders of dismissal are arbitrary, vindictive, and against the principles of Natural Justice.
Regards
From India, Salem
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My sincere thanks to all of you, including Mr. Umakanthan, for your kind participation.
Mr. Dinesh Divakar, your answer did not elicit what I have actually needed. I exclusively requested if the non-workmen were terminated and if my termination was not accepted by them, where can they seek redressal? Mr. Umakanthan has shed light on this in his last sentence, and Mr. Pankaj also provided some insights. Therefore, I once again request you to clarify which is the appropriate forum for them to seek redressal, keeping in mind that I have not made any procedural violation for termination. Please do not give weight to the procedures, repercussions, or remedies. It’s my headache, and I don’t need to worry about the later effects on my industry consequent to these terminations. I only need to know what is the appropriate forum or competent court for the non-workmen category that takes their issue on file for examination.
Mr. Pankaj Saab, I don’t want to breach my contract at any cost. As per our appointment orders, I intend to invoke the appropriate condition of termination and, after following due procedure as laid down in principles of natural justice, I intend to terminate them. If you still believe that the aggrieved has to invoke the provisions of the Indian Contract Act, according to you, which is the appropriate court that takes the complaint of the aggrieved on file and under which provision?
Mr. Umakanthan, it is generally said that managers (non-workmen) have to approach the civil court for their redressal. But, I need to know what is the appropriate lower court for them to file their petitions/complaints. Can the court for small causes, i.e., the Junior Civil Judge Court, who is also the Judicial 1st Class Magistrate for criminal offenses, try their cases? Or do the Administrative Tribunals, which are for government employees and PSUs, have any role to play? Please confine your reply to any district in the State of Tamil Nadu.
Thank you all, once again, for your valuable participation.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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Mr. Dinesh Divakar, your answer did not elicit what I have actually needed. I exclusively requested if the non-workmen were terminated and if my termination was not accepted by them, where can they seek redressal? Mr. Umakanthan has shed light on this in his last sentence, and Mr. Pankaj also provided some insights. Therefore, I once again request you to clarify which is the appropriate forum for them to seek redressal, keeping in mind that I have not made any procedural violation for termination. Please do not give weight to the procedures, repercussions, or remedies. It’s my headache, and I don’t need to worry about the later effects on my industry consequent to these terminations. I only need to know what is the appropriate forum or competent court for the non-workmen category that takes their issue on file for examination.
Mr. Pankaj Saab, I don’t want to breach my contract at any cost. As per our appointment orders, I intend to invoke the appropriate condition of termination and, after following due procedure as laid down in principles of natural justice, I intend to terminate them. If you still believe that the aggrieved has to invoke the provisions of the Indian Contract Act, according to you, which is the appropriate court that takes the complaint of the aggrieved on file and under which provision?
Mr. Umakanthan, it is generally said that managers (non-workmen) have to approach the civil court for their redressal. But, I need to know what is the appropriate lower court for them to file their petitions/complaints. Can the court for small causes, i.e., the Junior Civil Judge Court, who is also the Judicial 1st Class Magistrate for criminal offenses, try their cases? Or do the Administrative Tribunals, which are for government employees and PSUs, have any role to play? Please confine your reply to any district in the State of Tamil Nadu.
Thank you all, once again, for your valuable participation.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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Dear Kesav Panda,
Your question can be better answered by a practicing civil lawyer, not by people like us who have little to no exposure to litigation in civil and criminal courts. The best we can do is indicate possible courses of action in response to the premature or unilateral closure of a contract. If I am correct, the District Munsif Court has the original jurisdiction to try such civil cases.
From India, Salem
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Your question can be better answered by a practicing civil lawyer, not by people like us who have little to no exposure to litigation in civil and criminal courts. The best we can do is indicate possible courses of action in response to the premature or unilateral closure of a contract. If I am correct, the District Munsif Court has the original jurisdiction to try such civil cases.
From India, Salem
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Domestic Inquiry and Termination Process
If the supervisor and middle-level manager are involved in some misconduct, then you may order a domestic inquiry. If misconduct is proven during the inquiry, they may be terminated. The gravity of the misconduct will determine the extent of the punishment, with termination being the most severe penalty.
Redressal by the Aggrieved Party
If the terminated employees believe that the principles of natural justice were not followed during their termination, they may file a civil suit challenging the decision. It will be up to the court to determine the validity of the termination. The court may either uphold the termination or instruct your company to reinstate the employees with payment of back wages. The court's decision could fall anywhere between these two extremes.
Clarification on Your Query
In your initial post, you raised questions from both perspectives. On one hand, you inquired about the termination process, and on the other hand, you asked about the available remedies to challenge a termination. It would be helpful to focus on one aspect and pose a specific query.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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If the supervisor and middle-level manager are involved in some misconduct, then you may order a domestic inquiry. If misconduct is proven during the inquiry, they may be terminated. The gravity of the misconduct will determine the extent of the punishment, with termination being the most severe penalty.
Redressal by the Aggrieved Party
If the terminated employees believe that the principles of natural justice were not followed during their termination, they may file a civil suit challenging the decision. It will be up to the court to determine the validity of the termination. The court may either uphold the termination or instruct your company to reinstate the employees with payment of back wages. The court's decision could fall anywhere between these two extremes.
Clarification on Your Query
In your initial post, you raised questions from both perspectives. On one hand, you inquired about the termination process, and on the other hand, you asked about the available remedies to challenge a termination. It would be helpful to focus on one aspect and pose a specific query.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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Mr. Divakar,
You are absolutely right. I have asked about both the current action as well as the repercussions if the action is instituted. The first one is the action to be taken by me as they have lost confidence. In case the aggrieved party intends to seek redressal, where can they prefer the same, and who may send notices to appear before them? In your opinion, which civil court may ask me to appear before it?
Thank you.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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You are absolutely right. I have asked about both the current action as well as the repercussions if the action is instituted. The first one is the action to be taken by me as they have lost confidence. In case the aggrieved party intends to seek redressal, where can they prefer the same, and who may send notices to appear before them? In your opinion, which civil court may ask me to appear before it?
Thank you.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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Responding to Legal Actions Post-Termination
If you terminate employees and they file a suit against your company, then your company will be the respondent. Although the summons will be issued to the company, it must be represented by somebody. Since the Managing Director (MD) is usually the owner of the company, the decision on who should represent the company is one that your MD will make.
Are you concerned about appearing in court? If you are from HR, your company may require you to be a witness. In such circumstances, your personal appearance is unavoidable. There is no harm in standing in the witness box; it can be an experience in itself.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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If you terminate employees and they file a suit against your company, then your company will be the respondent. Although the summons will be issued to the company, it must be represented by somebody. Since the Managing Director (MD) is usually the owner of the company, the decision on who should represent the company is one that your MD will make.
Are you concerned about appearing in court? If you are from HR, your company may require you to be a witness. In such circumstances, your personal appearance is unavoidable. There is no harm in standing in the witness box; it can be an experience in itself.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Panda, Several forum members have shed light on your query very well, and I appreciate it. I further note that you want to terminate the persons in a way that avoids any challenge to your termination order. If challenged, it should withstand legal scrutiny. If my understanding is correct, I wish to inform you as follows:
1. You mentioned they are not workmen, but there is no guarantee in law. There is an Apex Court Judgment (I do not recall presently) that outlines 4 to 5 tests to determine workman status. If a person meets any one test, they would be considered a workman. It all depends on the evidence available.
2. Civil Courts in your area have jurisdiction to handle such disputes. An employee can challenge their termination order in civil court on various grounds, such as violations of the law, appointment terms, and Standing Orders, etc.
Thank you.
From India, Panipat
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1. You mentioned they are not workmen, but there is no guarantee in law. There is an Apex Court Judgment (I do not recall presently) that outlines 4 to 5 tests to determine workman status. If a person meets any one test, they would be considered a workman. It all depends on the evidence available.
2. Civil Courts in your area have jurisdiction to handle such disputes. An employee can challenge their termination order in civil court on various grounds, such as violations of the law, appointment terms, and Standing Orders, etc.
Thank you.
From India, Panipat
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Thank you very much to all who have participated in it. I now advise the aggrieved party to seek recourse by consulting a suitable lawyer at a civil court if they are not satisfied with the termination process I followed, based on the grounds of losing the trust of the management.
From India, Visakhapatnam
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From India, Visakhapatnam
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