there may be dozen of previous employer, so does it matter? for a week-time one person got employed at one establishment, and simultaneously he got employed in four establishments in all four weeks, he is member for all establishments unless the ECR is paid, but after the completion of ECR employer has to click exit option, .....if the employee already switched then it would show that "no more employee with you" otherwise EXIT should be submitted.
and yes all four would submit his contribution for different time slot, here if any employer link the UAN at payment time, in place of actual joining time, then he would be termed as last employer, and department will deem that the employee is continuing with that employer .
just imagine that some person worked from 01/01/2017 to 10/01/2017, and the HR department seeds his UAN just before making ECR i.e 5th feb ......... then how he can be able to make exit on 10/01/2017? as system will not allow him to make the entry on the date before joining entry. .......
630and yes all four would submit his contribution for different time slot, here if any employer link the UAN at payment time, in place of actual joining time, then he would be termed as last employer, and department will deem that the employee is continuing with that employer .
just imagine that some person worked from 01/01/2017 to 10/01/2017, and the HR department seeds his UAN just before making ECR i.e 5th feb ......... then how he can be able to make exit on 10/01/2017? as system will not allow him to make the entry on the date before joining entry. .......
And Mr. Sharma I have one more query. I know we can check the active members' service history. But if somebody leave our organization today can we see him in active members field? Can we trace him out about his whereabouts or may where he has joined from his UAN details. Active member section shows the service history of active members only. How to get the details of the employees who have already left but used to be our employees till 10 days ago.
From India, Kolkata
From India, Kolkata
So for the employee who left my company on 15th January and joined another organization on the very next day I can see his employment details in active member section?
But nothing is showing there.
Can we check the employments of the ex employees from Active Member section? Because they are not active members of my establishment anymore!
From India, Kolkata
But nothing is showing there.
Can we check the employments of the ex employees from Active Member section? Because they are not active members of my establishment anymore!
From India, Kolkata
And one more question please. May be this is the last one. :-)
As you have stated earlier unless an employer uploads ECR for an employee the employment is not confirmed from HR perspective.
So employee can not see this company in his own member portal till the time employer uploads the ECR, after uploading employee can see it in his own portal. Right?
Is this rule same for employer? I mean I can check the service history details of my employees, also can see the current employers of those employees who have already left. But in this case also unless his employer uploads the ecr his employment is not confirmed so I can see his current employer if his employer has uploaded the ECR, otherwise not. right?
Suppose A has left my company on 15th and joined another on 18th January his present employer has definitely linked his UAN with their establishment code by now, but not uploaded any ecr for him yet. So neither he can see that employer in his own member portal, nor I can see his current employer in my employer portal through member search or active members. Isn't it right? Only his current employer can see it. Please tell me
You have already clarified loads of my doubts and thank you very much for that. I have already bookmarked this conversation in my browser as I might need it in future also to refer to.
From India, Kolkata
As you have stated earlier unless an employer uploads ECR for an employee the employment is not confirmed from HR perspective.
So employee can not see this company in his own member portal till the time employer uploads the ECR, after uploading employee can see it in his own portal. Right?
Is this rule same for employer? I mean I can check the service history details of my employees, also can see the current employers of those employees who have already left. But in this case also unless his employer uploads the ecr his employment is not confirmed so I can see his current employer if his employer has uploaded the ECR, otherwise not. right?
Suppose A has left my company on 15th and joined another on 18th January his present employer has definitely linked his UAN with their establishment code by now, but not uploaded any ecr for him yet. So neither he can see that employer in his own member portal, nor I can see his current employer in my employer portal through member search or active members. Isn't it right? Only his current employer can see it. Please tell me
You have already clarified loads of my doubts and thank you very much for that. I have already bookmarked this conversation in my browser as I might need it in future also to refer to.
From India, Kolkata
there are many HRs who upload bulk UAN and thereafter show them left service, with zero days payment, you must have read that there are several posts about multiple UAN linking excel software search,
earlier this trouble was faced by ESIC department also, where the employer asked the IP no over mobile and on verbal talks seeded another person's IP, ..........and with no fault of the actual IP he got the trouble, and made request to his original employer to re enter the same, and issue TIC
but this time both the departments are shaking hands through unified portal, at shram suvidha, where combo return of ESIC and EPF both would be submitted, and EPFO has made it strict .........rule that no aadhaar no epf account, so mere uan number providing can not empower any employer to link, they have got something more than UAN number
However in this transit period , few employees can face trouble, but in long run HR personals have to be careful about their job, other wise department would initiate random vigilance visits and penal actin against such establishments
earlier this trouble was faced by ESIC department also, where the employer asked the IP no over mobile and on verbal talks seeded another person's IP, ..........and with no fault of the actual IP he got the trouble, and made request to his original employer to re enter the same, and issue TIC
but this time both the departments are shaking hands through unified portal, at shram suvidha, where combo return of ESIC and EPF both would be submitted, and EPFO has made it strict .........rule that no aadhaar no epf account, so mere uan number providing can not empower any employer to link, they have got something more than UAN number
However in this transit period , few employees can face trouble, but in long run HR personals have to be careful about their job, other wise department would initiate random vigilance visits and penal actin against such establishments
more than a dozen case i have handled , who left job in nov and joined in dec at other establishment, ....few have made earlier payment by 5th of january, and they got SMS over their old UAN seeded ( though there is new UAN for few employees who joined in oct and nov also, but we insist to add older, if old is KYC compliant and aadhaar seeded)
their service history is displaying well in both places. , some are yet to file ECR even, so how the department would consider the employee has been added by the HR on real grounds? in this run most bulk seeded UAN would get exit with zero payout, due to wrong seeding
department is also keeping a tab on such establishments, manual errors can be everywhere, but adding bulk persons , and making exit without payout, is under surveillance
their service history is displaying well in both places. , some are yet to file ECR even, so how the department would consider the employee has been added by the HR on real grounds? in this run most bulk seeded UAN would get exit with zero payout, due to wrong seeding
department is also keeping a tab on such establishments, manual errors can be everywhere, but adding bulk persons , and making exit without payout, is under surveillance
Ok, Understood. But sir my question was unless ECR is uploaded employee can not see the employer name in his own portal as you have stated earlier. Is this same with ex employer? If A left my organization on 15th and joined another one on 18th January, since his new employer has not uploaded an ECR for him he can not see this new employer in his own member portal. But I being his ex employer can I also see it now where he has joined? Or the viewing rights are a bit flexible towards the employer and even though his new employer has not uploaded ECR yet I can see where he joined.
Provided Aadhar was there and new employer also used Aadhar while linking.
From India, Kolkata
Provided Aadhar was there and new employer also used Aadhar while linking.
From India, Kolkata
after 1st payment or digital verification the service history will be available to both, or to all employers under the same UAN, this is for ease of payment of arrears ( if any)
I guess for those who have left in November but the employer is yet to file ECR, the employer can not do it now. There is no way he can do it now.
I have even seen some companies hold pf deposit till the time full and final settlement is not finalised though fnf has got nothing to do with EPFO. but by the the previous company finalized it and is going to depsoit the pf amount the emploee is already linked with another company. And if the previous company tries to relink it once again the present employer gets untagged. Also the employee will come under dual employment then because the previous employer can not make exit before registration date. I don't know how EPFO is going to address these issues.
UAN should be generated and given within a week a joining now. This should be the new rule otherwise there will be trouble for employees.
From India, Kolkata
I have even seen some companies hold pf deposit till the time full and final settlement is not finalised though fnf has got nothing to do with EPFO. but by the the previous company finalized it and is going to depsoit the pf amount the emploee is already linked with another company. And if the previous company tries to relink it once again the present employer gets untagged. Also the employee will come under dual employment then because the previous employer can not make exit before registration date. I don't know how EPFO is going to address these issues.
UAN should be generated and given within a week a joining now. This should be the new rule otherwise there will be trouble for employees.
From India, Kolkata
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Payment of PF after closure of establishment 23.5.12.pdf