The eligibility for a pension is a minimum of 10 years of service after 1995. I joined the PF Scheme in 1981. Is past service considered for pension eligibility? Secondly, I have taken a withdrawal of PF. Does this mean that I will not be eligible for a pension since I withdrew the entire PF amount? In my past organization, I received two cheques, hence I have a doubt.
From India, Pune
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1From India, Pune
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Dear Mr. Ravi D Joshi,
Your service before 16th November 1995 will also be taken into account for the eligibility as well as the calculation of pension, provided you have contributed to the Family Pension Scheme and EPS-95.
Abbas P. S
From India, Bangalore
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Your service before 16th November 1995 will also be taken into account for the eligibility as well as the calculation of pension, provided you have contributed to the Family Pension Scheme and EPS-95.
Abbas P. S
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Mr. Abbas,
Thank you for your response. I have contributed to both schemes earlier. My total service before 1995 was 15 years and after 1995 - 8 years. But in 2004, I had taken a withdrawal. I received 2 cheques: 1. "Settlement of P.F. Accumulation" and 2. "Withdrawal Benefit Accumulation" against my PF account with the last employer. Please let me know if I am still eligible for a pension.
From India, Pune
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Thank you for your response. I have contributed to both schemes earlier. My total service before 1995 was 15 years and after 1995 - 8 years. But in 2004, I had taken a withdrawal. I received 2 cheques: 1. "Settlement of P.F. Accumulation" and 2. "Withdrawal Benefit Accumulation" against my PF account with the last employer. Please let me know if I am still eligible for a pension.
From India, Pune
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Dear Ravi,
Yours is an interesting case and hence needs to be understood in detail to be in a position to judge what actually happened and as to whether you are still eligible for pension.
- Have you, in your tenure from 1981, worked with only one organization or more? Can you give us the exact employment dates with one or more organizations that you were employed with?
- Has there been a change in the company's name while you were working with them (if so, then when was it?)?
- During your tenure with any of these organizations, did any of the organizations change or transfer the PF Office for the PF dues submission?
- Do you remember the joining date that you would have mentioned in both the withdrawal forms - 19 & 10C?
If my assumption is correct, then maybe I have a logical reason for what would have happened in your case. But, that depends on what transpired during this period, and hence, I'll wait for your answer.
Regards,
A.B.
From India, Mumbai
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Yours is an interesting case and hence needs to be understood in detail to be in a position to judge what actually happened and as to whether you are still eligible for pension.
- Have you, in your tenure from 1981, worked with only one organization or more? Can you give us the exact employment dates with one or more organizations that you were employed with?
- Has there been a change in the company's name while you were working with them (if so, then when was it?)?
- During your tenure with any of these organizations, did any of the organizations change or transfer the PF Office for the PF dues submission?
- Do you remember the joining date that you would have mentioned in both the withdrawal forms - 19 & 10C?
If my assumption is correct, then maybe I have a logical reason for what would have happened in your case. But, that depends on what transpired during this period, and hence, I'll wait for your answer.
Regards,
A.B.
From India, Mumbai
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Dear A.B.,
Please find my feedback on your questions:
- Have you, during your tenure from 1981, worked with only one organization or more? Can you provide the exact employment dates with one or more organizations that you were employed with?
Organization Employment Dates
Organization 1: 1-Jan-1981 to 15-Apr-1995
Organization 2: 2-May-1995 to 1-Jan-1999
Organization 3: 4-Jan-1999 to 10-Mar-2003
I worked in Organization 4 from Jun-2003 to Jan-2004 with no PF. I joined Organization 5 on 2-Feb-2004 and worked until 14-Nov-2012 (till the age of 58). This organization also had no PF.
The PF withdrawal took place in Nov 2004, as Organizations 4 & 5 had no PF.
A letter from EPFO mentions the final/partial settlement of PF accumulations and withdrawal benefit accumulation against PF Account No (of Organization No. 3). Thus, I received 2 cheques.
- Has there been a change in the company's name while you were working with them (if so, when was it)?
No, there was no change in the company name.
- During your tenure with any of these organizations, did any of the organizations change/transfer the PF Office for the PF dues submission?
No information on this. All the above organizations are large organizations of repute.
- Do you remember the joining date that you would have mentioned in both the withdrawal forms - 19 & 10C?
I do not remember.
Thanks.
From India, Pune
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Please find my feedback on your questions:
- Have you, during your tenure from 1981, worked with only one organization or more? Can you provide the exact employment dates with one or more organizations that you were employed with?
Organization Employment Dates
Organization 1: 1-Jan-1981 to 15-Apr-1995
Organization 2: 2-May-1995 to 1-Jan-1999
Organization 3: 4-Jan-1999 to 10-Mar-2003
I worked in Organization 4 from Jun-2003 to Jan-2004 with no PF. I joined Organization 5 on 2-Feb-2004 and worked until 14-Nov-2012 (till the age of 58). This organization also had no PF.
The PF withdrawal took place in Nov 2004, as Organizations 4 & 5 had no PF.
A letter from EPFO mentions the final/partial settlement of PF accumulations and withdrawal benefit accumulation against PF Account No (of Organization No. 3). Thus, I received 2 cheques.
- Has there been a change in the company's name while you were working with them (if so, when was it)?
No, there was no change in the company name.
- During your tenure with any of these organizations, did any of the organizations change/transfer the PF Office for the PF dues submission?
No information on this. All the above organizations are large organizations of repute.
- Do you remember the joining date that you would have mentioned in both the withdrawal forms - 19 & 10C?
I do not remember.
Thanks.
From India, Pune
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Excellent.
As per your note, you do not have any PF dues with regard to your employment with Organizations 4, 5, & 6. The two cheques that you have received are related to your account concerning your employment with Organization 3.
However, as I understand, you have not withdrawn or transferred your PF with regard to your employment with Org.-1 & 2, correct?
If that is so, then I would suggest the following:
- Fill up the withdrawal forms for Organization 1 and ask your organization (Org. 1) to submit it at the respective PF office. You may be required to submit details pertaining to your family members (details on required documents can be inquired from your organization/the respective PF office where the contribution would have been deposited). The PF office will pay you your PF emolument but will issue you a scheme certificate for pension.
- Fill up the withdrawal forms for Organization 2 and ask your organization 2 to submit it at the respective PF office along with this scheme certificate. Again, you may have to submit several documents, including your bank account details, particularly due to the pension aspect. If the submission is correct, you should receive your PF emolument within 15 days. You will also receive an intimation regarding your pension, which will state details regarding where/which bank/which account it will get credited. Subsequent months onwards, you should start receiving the pension amount too.
I know the process is a bit lengthy and tedious, but it's because you did not attend to it when you should have done it. Anyways, try it out and revert to me in case of any issues.
(One suggestion: Try meeting the respective PF AC of the particular group to which your company (organization 2) belonged to and check from him if this process is proper. At the end of the day, it is this PF Office that will need to process your pension payment.)
Let me know the outcome.
Good Luck, A.B.
From India, Mumbai
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As per your note, you do not have any PF dues with regard to your employment with Organizations 4, 5, & 6. The two cheques that you have received are related to your account concerning your employment with Organization 3.
However, as I understand, you have not withdrawn or transferred your PF with regard to your employment with Org.-1 & 2, correct?
If that is so, then I would suggest the following:
- Fill up the withdrawal forms for Organization 1 and ask your organization (Org. 1) to submit it at the respective PF office. You may be required to submit details pertaining to your family members (details on required documents can be inquired from your organization/the respective PF office where the contribution would have been deposited). The PF office will pay you your PF emolument but will issue you a scheme certificate for pension.
- Fill up the withdrawal forms for Organization 2 and ask your organization 2 to submit it at the respective PF office along with this scheme certificate. Again, you may have to submit several documents, including your bank account details, particularly due to the pension aspect. If the submission is correct, you should receive your PF emolument within 15 days. You will also receive an intimation regarding your pension, which will state details regarding where/which bank/which account it will get credited. Subsequent months onwards, you should start receiving the pension amount too.
I know the process is a bit lengthy and tedious, but it's because you did not attend to it when you should have done it. Anyways, try it out and revert to me in case of any issues.
(One suggestion: Try meeting the respective PF AC of the particular group to which your company (organization 2) belonged to and check from him if this process is proper. At the end of the day, it is this PF Office that will need to process your pension payment.)
Let me know the outcome.
Good Luck, A.B.
From India, Mumbai
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Thank you for your prompt reply. I forgot to mention that as I changed jobs from organization 1 to 2 and then to 3, PF was transferred by the respective organizations. Hence, I received the entire amount when I applied for withdrawal after leaving organization 3. The two cheques I received from organization 3 are for the cumulative amount for all three organizations.
My only doubt is that since PF has been withdrawn entirely, is there still a chance to receive a pension now that I have completed 60 years in Nov 14? I have drawn the conclusion that the "entire amount of PF - all contributions from Employee + Employer" has been withdrawn as a result of the two cheques I received. Please confirm if this is correct.
As suggested by you, I will approach the PF Office also.
From India, Pune
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My only doubt is that since PF has been withdrawn entirely, is there still a chance to receive a pension now that I have completed 60 years in Nov 14? I have drawn the conclusion that the "entire amount of PF - all contributions from Employee + Employer" has been withdrawn as a result of the two cheques I received. Please confirm if this is correct.
As suggested by you, I will approach the PF Office also.
From India, Pune
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Dear Mr. Joshi,
As per my opinion, you are eligible for Pension, since you have transferred your PF for all the 3 organizations (which are covered under EPF), so accordingly your pension fund also got transferred till your last service. Now the major point where you are getting confusion is "you have got two cheques" hence you are assuming that one cheque is for EPF (Employee Contribution) and the second cheque is for Pension amount (Being paid towards Pension as employer contribution).
Please note that the employer contribution is further segregated into two parts i.e. EPS (Employees' Pension Fund) and EPF Difference.
The contribution towards EPS (Employee Pension Scheme) was earlier restricted to @ 8.33% of Basic or Rs. 541/- (whichever is less). The excess amount of employer contribution (beyond Rs. 541/-) shifted to EPF Difference (Employer).
Let's now clear your point with an example, if your basic was Rs. 10,000/-, the segregation of your EPF contribution will be:-
Month EPF Pension Difference
Jan 1200 541 659
Feb 1200 541 659
Mar 1200 541 659
Total 3600 1623 1977
Two cheques you received for Rs. 3600/- & 1977/- contributions. The Pension amount was held by the EPF Authorities. Generally, when we withdraw EPF and we are eligible for pension, the PF official issues a certificate which the member should submit after attaining the age of 58 or 60 years.
On submission of the certificate and other formalities, the pension gets started in the nominated bank.
As suggested by the other senior and experienced members, you can visit the PF Office, submit your points, if really the Pension Fund withheld with PF Office, seek their advice on what formalities would be required for Pension.
If the matter does not solve, please go to some senior officials as well, because your case is really an interesting one.
If you really find it difficult, you can take help from any reputed consultant.
Please share your feedback and output with the forum as well to enhance our practical knowledge as well.
PAN SINGH DANGWAL
9560476777 (pansingh_dangwal@yahoo.co.in)
From India, Delhi
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As per my opinion, you are eligible for Pension, since you have transferred your PF for all the 3 organizations (which are covered under EPF), so accordingly your pension fund also got transferred till your last service. Now the major point where you are getting confusion is "you have got two cheques" hence you are assuming that one cheque is for EPF (Employee Contribution) and the second cheque is for Pension amount (Being paid towards Pension as employer contribution).
Please note that the employer contribution is further segregated into two parts i.e. EPS (Employees' Pension Fund) and EPF Difference.
The contribution towards EPS (Employee Pension Scheme) was earlier restricted to @ 8.33% of Basic or Rs. 541/- (whichever is less). The excess amount of employer contribution (beyond Rs. 541/-) shifted to EPF Difference (Employer).
Let's now clear your point with an example, if your basic was Rs. 10,000/-, the segregation of your EPF contribution will be:-
Month EPF Pension Difference
Jan 1200 541 659
Feb 1200 541 659
Mar 1200 541 659
Total 3600 1623 1977
Two cheques you received for Rs. 3600/- & 1977/- contributions. The Pension amount was held by the EPF Authorities. Generally, when we withdraw EPF and we are eligible for pension, the PF official issues a certificate which the member should submit after attaining the age of 58 or 60 years.
On submission of the certificate and other formalities, the pension gets started in the nominated bank.
As suggested by the other senior and experienced members, you can visit the PF Office, submit your points, if really the Pension Fund withheld with PF Office, seek their advice on what formalities would be required for Pension.
If the matter does not solve, please go to some senior officials as well, because your case is really an interesting one.
If you really find it difficult, you can take help from any reputed consultant.
Please share your feedback and output with the forum as well to enhance our practical knowledge as well.
PAN SINGH DANGWAL
9560476777 (pansingh_dangwal@yahoo.co.in)
From India, Delhi
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Thank you, Mr. Pan Singh.
I believe I have received 2 cheques with details as follows:
1. EPF: Employer Contribution + My Contribution (Opening Balances + Contribution/Interest ...) similar to PF Slips that we used to receive for every financial year.
2. I think the second cheque is for an amount of 49010/-, which is equivalent to 6500 * 7.54 (Table D). I believe they have considered 7 years of my service from May 1995 to March 2003 and ignored my service from January 1981 to April 1995. The rule they have applied, in my opinion, is 10 years of service after the EPS scheme came into effect in 1995. However, the question arises: what happens to my earlier FPS scheme? A separate FPS Account number was allocated in addition to the PF Account number. Therefore, it seems that I may not be eligible for a pension. Nevertheless, I will still consult with the PF Officer or a Consultant.
From India, Pune
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I believe I have received 2 cheques with details as follows:
1. EPF: Employer Contribution + My Contribution (Opening Balances + Contribution/Interest ...) similar to PF Slips that we used to receive for every financial year.
2. I think the second cheque is for an amount of 49010/-, which is equivalent to 6500 * 7.54 (Table D). I believe they have considered 7 years of my service from May 1995 to March 2003 and ignored my service from January 1981 to April 1995. The rule they have applied, in my opinion, is 10 years of service after the EPS scheme came into effect in 1995. However, the question arises: what happens to my earlier FPS scheme? A separate FPS Account number was allocated in addition to the PF Account number. Therefore, it seems that I may not be eligible for a pension. Nevertheless, I will still consult with the PF Officer or a Consultant.
From India, Pune
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Dear Mr. Joshi,
Do you have salary/PF details for the last 10 years of your service? Please provide the same. Also, could you share the amount of your second cheque?
I will do my best to provide you with the details of the cheques received, although it may be quite complex and lengthy.
Thank you.
From India, Delhi
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Do you have salary/PF details for the last 10 years of your service? Please provide the same. Also, could you share the amount of your second cheque?
I will do my best to provide you with the details of the cheques received, although it may be quite complex and lengthy.
Thank you.
From India, Delhi
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Hello,
As requested, please find the salary details from the salary slip for the last 10 years. Up to 2003, there was no PF after this.
Organization 1: 1-Jan-1981 to 15-Apr-1995
Organization 2: 2-May-1995 to 1-Jan-1999
Organization 3: 4-Jan-1999 to 10-Mar-2003
| Year | Basic | DA | PF - Employee | PF | FPF | Organization |
|----------|-------|------|---------------|-----|-----|---------------|
| 1994-95 | 8050 | | 805 | 747 | 58 | Organization 2 |
| 1995-96 | 6000 | 950 | 695 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1996-97 | 7500 | 950 | 845 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1997-98 | 8010 | 950 | 1075 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1998-99 | 8010 | 950 | 1075 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1999-2000| 16550 | | 1986 | | | Organization 3 |
| 2000-2001| 19115 | | 2294 | | | Organization 3 |
| 2001-2002| 21305 | | 2557 | | | Organization 3 |
| 2002-2003| 21305 | | 2557 | | | Organization 3 |
Please let me know if you need any further information.
From India, Pune
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As requested, please find the salary details from the salary slip for the last 10 years. Up to 2003, there was no PF after this.
Organization 1: 1-Jan-1981 to 15-Apr-1995
Organization 2: 2-May-1995 to 1-Jan-1999
Organization 3: 4-Jan-1999 to 10-Mar-2003
| Year | Basic | DA | PF - Employee | PF | FPF | Organization |
|----------|-------|------|---------------|-----|-----|---------------|
| 1994-95 | 8050 | | 805 | 747 | 58 | Organization 2 |
| 1995-96 | 6000 | 950 | 695 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1996-97 | 7500 | 950 | 845 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1997-98 | 8010 | 950 | 1075 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1998-99 | 8010 | 950 | 1075 | | | Organization 2 |
| 1999-2000| 16550 | | 1986 | | | Organization 3 |
| 2000-2001| 19115 | | 2294 | | | Organization 3 |
| 2001-2002| 21305 | | 2557 | | | Organization 3 |
| 2002-2003| 21305 | | 2557 | | | Organization 3 |
Please let me know if you need any further information.
From India, Pune
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Hi Sending details once again in attachment. Regards Ravindra Joshi
From India, Pune
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From India, Pune
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Hi,
The amount of my second cheque was Rs. 49,010. However, from January 1981 until April 1995 (1st organization), there were deductions of PF and FPF as per the salary slips for all those years. Similarly, in my second organization, I had 2 PF account numbers, one for PF and the other for FPS. In the case of the 3rd organization, there was only one PF account number. I also heard that the government also contributed after 1995 - 1.67%.
Thank you.
From India, Pune
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The amount of my second cheque was Rs. 49,010. However, from January 1981 until April 1995 (1st organization), there were deductions of PF and FPF as per the salary slips for all those years. Similarly, in my second organization, I had 2 PF account numbers, one for PF and the other for FPS. In the case of the 3rd organization, there was only one PF account number. I also heard that the government also contributed after 1995 - 1.67%.
Thank you.
From India, Pune
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Hello everybody. I am back again.
As per suggestions, I approached EPFO through my last employer where I worked from Jan 1999 to Mar 2003. What I came to know is the amount of Rs. 49010/- I received from EPFO in 2004 was actually a contribution by Employers - 1. From the period May 1995 to Dec 1998 and 2. Jan 1999 to Mar 2003. (@90 Months * 541 = 49010), since the transfer of EPS for the earlier employer Jan 1981 to Apr 1995 did not happen. So EPFO asked me to submit Form 13. This is now submitted and awaiting the response from EPFO.
Will I get a pension on the past service contribution or do I have to return the amount of Rs. 49010/- I received in 2004 with interest, and then they will start the pension?
From India, Pune
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As per suggestions, I approached EPFO through my last employer where I worked from Jan 1999 to Mar 2003. What I came to know is the amount of Rs. 49010/- I received from EPFO in 2004 was actually a contribution by Employers - 1. From the period May 1995 to Dec 1998 and 2. Jan 1999 to Mar 2003. (@90 Months * 541 = 49010), since the transfer of EPS for the earlier employer Jan 1981 to Apr 1995 did not happen. So EPFO asked me to submit Form 13. This is now submitted and awaiting the response from EPFO.
Will I get a pension on the past service contribution or do I have to return the amount of Rs. 49010/- I received in 2004 with interest, and then they will start the pension?
From India, Pune
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