My boss is the non-delegator kind. She does everything herself. I do it and she will redo it. I check, and she will re-check. A frustrating boss who has little confidence in herself, even less in me. I feel very marginalized, bypassed. I've sent numerous emails on initiatives that I want to undertake but never got any response. Her idea of giving me responsibility is giving me charge of organizing Diwali sweets and judging a fancy dress competition.
The problem is that she sits in Mumbai, and I am in Delhi. I've tried to communicate with her, but it hasn't had any positive results. She just ignores me and gives me vague answers. Her communication is all about 'I I I' and talks so much that it's tiresome and unbecoming of someone who's heading a function.
Honestly, I believe that I can do a far better job than she does but she's smartly fooled the senior management into believing she's doing a fantastic job.
I just don't know how to handle this situation. I want to do a lot more and feel that I am not learning anything. Please help.
From India, Delhi
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The problem is that she sits in Mumbai, and I am in Delhi. I've tried to communicate with her, but it hasn't had any positive results. She just ignores me and gives me vague answers. Her communication is all about 'I I I' and talks so much that it's tiresome and unbecoming of someone who's heading a function.
Honestly, I believe that I can do a far better job than she does but she's smartly fooled the senior management into believing she's doing a fantastic job.
I just don't know how to handle this situation. I want to do a lot more and feel that I am not learning anything. Please help.
From India, Delhi
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i’ve been trying to get out but in this economic slump, it’s difficult to get a job. any other suggestion while i am here?
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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Keep learning things theoretically, do training programs for your people in personality development topics, provide solutions for some practical problems posted on citehr, keep yourself updated with creative concepts, continue writing your own creative ideas, and share them with those in need. Most importantly, keep striving for good opportunities. :icon1:
From India, Mangaluru
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18From India, Mangaluru
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Hi,
Identify certain areas where you do not require the approval of your senior. Things like organizing Friday events (games) etc., which do not require any monetary support from the senior. It is not clear from your post if you are handling the HR or Employee care role. Try to connect with a peer of your boss and explain the situation and seek advice.
Last but the more effective one is always to talk straight to your boss. Tell her that though you require her guidance and support, you are in a position to handle things independently. Dispel her doubts about your capability. You will find such resistance in all organizations as the boss has their own insecurities to deal with. So the best way to do that is to tell him you are his friend rather than a foe.
Warm Regards,
Ramya
From India
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Identify certain areas where you do not require the approval of your senior. Things like organizing Friday events (games) etc., which do not require any monetary support from the senior. It is not clear from your post if you are handling the HR or Employee care role. Try to connect with a peer of your boss and explain the situation and seek advice.
Last but the more effective one is always to talk straight to your boss. Tell her that though you require her guidance and support, you are in a position to handle things independently. Dispel her doubts about your capability. You will find such resistance in all organizations as the boss has their own insecurities to deal with. So the best way to do that is to tell him you are his friend rather than a foe.
Warm Regards,
Ramya
From India
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Thanks for the advice!
I am an HR Generalist now; previously, I had an extensive recruitment background. I want to get into comp & ben, Performance management, etc. The problem in the current org is that HR is new, and this is an industry where HR has never existed. It was handled by Finance. HR has come into being only a little over a year in our organization.
But it's appalling to see that HR, headed by my boss, has achieved so little so far. She herself is not from a hardcore HR background; her strength lies only in training. Perhaps that's why she's not reclaimed back the HR role from Finance, and each time I talk of C&B initiatives, even policies, she says that she can decide only after consulting with Finance, a decision that never comes. She has about 18 years of experience, and the team she has in Mumbai consists of secretaries and data entry operators who've moved into HR. Obviously, they haven't gone through adequate training and do not understand HR's role beyond paper-pushing.
Sometimes I wonder why she even hired me?! Clearly, my career aspirations and background do not match the rest of the team. And if she wanted to hire someone capable and senior enough, I don't understand why she can't empower me so I can do my job effectively?! At the time of the interview, she made it look like a challenging job where I would have the freedom to implement my ideas. "It's a blank canvas, feel free to paint," is what she had said. And I didn't want to do just a maintenance job in HR. So I joined, and now I've been duped!
In addition to this, I have to face hostility from the Finance guys who are another bunch of inefficient idiots! Unfortunately, they've been hired by the Delhi Head, so they're well protected. But me, no one cares about!
To give you a small example of how deeply this is affecting me - we'll be moving to a new office very soon. The other day we were going through the floor plan. My room is rather small, in fact, the smallest. Of course, the Finance guy's room is three times the size of my room. I dreamed that we'd shifted to the new office and that I was looking for my room. There it was, big letters in shiny steel hooked outside the door - 'HR.' I stepped in to find that it was, in fact, a bathroom!! One side with the bathtub and the other side was the basin and toilet. I objected and told them that that was no place for anyone to work in! They said that the bathtub was the perfect place for storing files and that I could use the toilet to sit on and work on my laptop :( So humiliating! It shows how demoralized I am and how I think my position and work are viewed by the management here!
I've had too many movements in my career, and I really wanted to stay on in a company this time and grow within the org. The CEO, who my boss reports into, also sits in Mumbai; it's hard for me to reach him.
Isn't it funny? We talk about bad managers and how HR can intervene and sort out issues. We suggest transfers to different teams. But how does one cope in a situation when the Head of HR herself is the problem for her team member?
And I sometimes even wonder about the seriousness and commitment of our CEO towards HR. Clearly, can't he see what the Head HR has been up to for the last one year? There is still no automation (we do everything manually on paper), policies haven't been revised and laid down as yet either! She's just trying to please the CEO by working on mission and vision statements, but the policies that govern the day-to-day running of the org that directly affect employee benefits still haven't been worked upon! I don't have answers to employee entitlements!
Sighhh! Any ideas?!
From India, Delhi
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I am an HR Generalist now; previously, I had an extensive recruitment background. I want to get into comp & ben, Performance management, etc. The problem in the current org is that HR is new, and this is an industry where HR has never existed. It was handled by Finance. HR has come into being only a little over a year in our organization.
But it's appalling to see that HR, headed by my boss, has achieved so little so far. She herself is not from a hardcore HR background; her strength lies only in training. Perhaps that's why she's not reclaimed back the HR role from Finance, and each time I talk of C&B initiatives, even policies, she says that she can decide only after consulting with Finance, a decision that never comes. She has about 18 years of experience, and the team she has in Mumbai consists of secretaries and data entry operators who've moved into HR. Obviously, they haven't gone through adequate training and do not understand HR's role beyond paper-pushing.
Sometimes I wonder why she even hired me?! Clearly, my career aspirations and background do not match the rest of the team. And if she wanted to hire someone capable and senior enough, I don't understand why she can't empower me so I can do my job effectively?! At the time of the interview, she made it look like a challenging job where I would have the freedom to implement my ideas. "It's a blank canvas, feel free to paint," is what she had said. And I didn't want to do just a maintenance job in HR. So I joined, and now I've been duped!
In addition to this, I have to face hostility from the Finance guys who are another bunch of inefficient idiots! Unfortunately, they've been hired by the Delhi Head, so they're well protected. But me, no one cares about!
To give you a small example of how deeply this is affecting me - we'll be moving to a new office very soon. The other day we were going through the floor plan. My room is rather small, in fact, the smallest. Of course, the Finance guy's room is three times the size of my room. I dreamed that we'd shifted to the new office and that I was looking for my room. There it was, big letters in shiny steel hooked outside the door - 'HR.' I stepped in to find that it was, in fact, a bathroom!! One side with the bathtub and the other side was the basin and toilet. I objected and told them that that was no place for anyone to work in! They said that the bathtub was the perfect place for storing files and that I could use the toilet to sit on and work on my laptop :( So humiliating! It shows how demoralized I am and how I think my position and work are viewed by the management here!
I've had too many movements in my career, and I really wanted to stay on in a company this time and grow within the org. The CEO, who my boss reports into, also sits in Mumbai; it's hard for me to reach him.
Isn't it funny? We talk about bad managers and how HR can intervene and sort out issues. We suggest transfers to different teams. But how does one cope in a situation when the Head of HR herself is the problem for her team member?
And I sometimes even wonder about the seriousness and commitment of our CEO towards HR. Clearly, can't he see what the Head HR has been up to for the last one year? There is still no automation (we do everything manually on paper), policies haven't been revised and laid down as yet either! She's just trying to please the CEO by working on mission and vision statements, but the policies that govern the day-to-day running of the org that directly affect employee benefits still haven't been worked upon! I don't have answers to employee entitlements!
Sighhh! Any ideas?!
From India, Delhi
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Hi friend,
Your current situation is really alarming. In the current scenario, you don't have many options left. But I would suggest that next time you send an email to your HR Head regarding any initiatives or other HR policy-related issues, make sure you call her and inform her about the email. Ask for feedback and suggestions on your email. If you don't receive any response within the given time, send her a reminder email and CC your CEO. This will definitely help you and is the best way to address HR-related issues and get in touch with your CEO.
If you don't receive positive feedback from your management, it's better to look for better opportunities than staying in your current position; otherwise, it will waste your precious time.
From India, Delhi
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Your current situation is really alarming. In the current scenario, you don't have many options left. But I would suggest that next time you send an email to your HR Head regarding any initiatives or other HR policy-related issues, make sure you call her and inform her about the email. Ask for feedback and suggestions on your email. If you don't receive any response within the given time, send her a reminder email and CC your CEO. This will definitely help you and is the best way to address HR-related issues and get in touch with your CEO.
If you don't receive positive feedback from your management, it's better to look for better opportunities than staying in your current position; otherwise, it will waste your precious time.
From India, Delhi
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Your's is an extreme case. Dealing and tackling boss(es) is one of the most important behavioral aspects of an HR professional. I'm sure you have read "Mahabharat" where Draupadi efficiently managed 5 bosses (read five Pandava). Never bypass your "Boss". Tackling bosses (read seniors) is an art and it varies from industry to industry, function to function; more importantly, the culture of the organization. A little more detail of the industry to which you belong and the business activities in your Delhi office, along with the hierarchy, may perhaps give us some basics to make available some alternative initiatives on how to overcome and win.
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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Hey people,
I face a somewhat similar problem. I have joined a new firm just a few months back as an HR Generalist, and right from the start, I have been facing a lot of problems in dealing with the higher management. The HR department has no powers at all, and everything has to be routed through the MD and VP of operations. I'm talking about petty day-to-day issues like stationary, attendance, and all.
A few days back, my boss and I had a meeting with the MD and VP, and we raised these points. The response we got was shocking, to say the least. The MD bluntly told me that he never understood what the HR guys are supposed to do.
Since joining, I have prepared every company policy and guideline from scratch, and the same have been approved by these two gentlemen. However, when it comes to implementation, they are the first to disapprove. It's like they want to run the company based on their whims and fancies.
Going to the chairman is not an option as he is the VP's father, and changing jobs is also not preferable as I don't want to leave my first job so soon.
Please help.
Thanks and regards,
Karan
From India, New Delhi
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I face a somewhat similar problem. I have joined a new firm just a few months back as an HR Generalist, and right from the start, I have been facing a lot of problems in dealing with the higher management. The HR department has no powers at all, and everything has to be routed through the MD and VP of operations. I'm talking about petty day-to-day issues like stationary, attendance, and all.
A few days back, my boss and I had a meeting with the MD and VP, and we raised these points. The response we got was shocking, to say the least. The MD bluntly told me that he never understood what the HR guys are supposed to do.
Since joining, I have prepared every company policy and guideline from scratch, and the same have been approved by these two gentlemen. However, when it comes to implementation, they are the first to disapprove. It's like they want to run the company based on their whims and fancies.
Going to the chairman is not an option as he is the VP's father, and changing jobs is also not preferable as I don't want to leave my first job so soon.
Please help.
Thanks and regards,
Karan
From India, New Delhi
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Well, I work in an ad agency. So, I report to the Head HR who reports to the CEO. I have a dotted line reporting to the Delhi Head and work closely with him. He also reports to the CEO.
The problem is that each time I tried to take her advice on initiatives, she replied by saying, ''I am planning to do this, I am talking to people to get this done, I will roll it out in a few months' time, don't worry, I already have it on my agenda and I will do it sometime soon''. Of course, she says all this very sweetly. We were both hired through a common headhunter and I'd shared my problem with him, and he had a word with her. The result of that was just sweet talk but no concrete action. She did praise me as well and told me when she heard my appreciation from anyone but never in writing. I have asked her for feedback on me, and it was positive. Then I don't know why she doesn't have the confidence in me and entrust me with more responsibility?!
I honestly also sometimes wonder if talking directly with the CEO would help as he thinks that my boss is a 'god-sent angel'! Certainly, I won't complain about her to him but just want to talk to him directly so that I can start executing things here. But I fear he may want to consult her and she will shoot down my ideas on some vague pretext or the other and will want to get rid of me. I'm due for confirmation next month and fear I might just end up jeopardizing it.
On the other hand, I also fear that others might just think that HR isn't doing much and ultimately it's my reputation as a professional that is getting marred.
I'm lost! Help please.
From India, Delhi
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The problem is that each time I tried to take her advice on initiatives, she replied by saying, ''I am planning to do this, I am talking to people to get this done, I will roll it out in a few months' time, don't worry, I already have it on my agenda and I will do it sometime soon''. Of course, she says all this very sweetly. We were both hired through a common headhunter and I'd shared my problem with him, and he had a word with her. The result of that was just sweet talk but no concrete action. She did praise me as well and told me when she heard my appreciation from anyone but never in writing. I have asked her for feedback on me, and it was positive. Then I don't know why she doesn't have the confidence in me and entrust me with more responsibility?!
I honestly also sometimes wonder if talking directly with the CEO would help as he thinks that my boss is a 'god-sent angel'! Certainly, I won't complain about her to him but just want to talk to him directly so that I can start executing things here. But I fear he may want to consult her and she will shoot down my ideas on some vague pretext or the other and will want to get rid of me. I'm due for confirmation next month and fear I might just end up jeopardizing it.
On the other hand, I also fear that others might just think that HR isn't doing much and ultimately it's my reputation as a professional that is getting marred.
I'm lost! Help please.
From India, Delhi
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Well, I work in an ad agency. So, I report to the Head HR who reports to the CEO. I have a dotted line reporting to the Delhi Head and work closely with him. He also reports to the CEO.
The problem is that each time I tried to take her advice on initiatives, she replied by saying, "I am planning to do this, I am talking to people to get this done, I will roll it out in a few months' time, don't worry, I already have it on my agenda, and I will do it sometime soon." Of course, she says all this very sweetly. We were both hired through a common headhunter, and I'd shared my problem with him, and he had a word with her. The result of that was just sweet talk but no concrete action. She did praise me as well and told me when she heard my appreciation from anyone but never in writing. I have asked her for feedback on me, and it was positive. Then I don't know why she doesn't have the confidence in me and entrust me with more responsibility?!
I fear talking to the CEO too as he thinks that she's a God-sent Angel! And if I talk to him directly about initiatives, I fear he might eventually consult her, and she will shoot down my ideas under some vague pretext or the other or simply even tell him that she's already working on it and will roll it out at an appropriate time or worse say that they are not good ideas. I'm due for confirmation next month, and I don't want to jeopardize it.
I'm lost! Help, please.
From India, Delhi
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The problem is that each time I tried to take her advice on initiatives, she replied by saying, "I am planning to do this, I am talking to people to get this done, I will roll it out in a few months' time, don't worry, I already have it on my agenda, and I will do it sometime soon." Of course, she says all this very sweetly. We were both hired through a common headhunter, and I'd shared my problem with him, and he had a word with her. The result of that was just sweet talk but no concrete action. She did praise me as well and told me when she heard my appreciation from anyone but never in writing. I have asked her for feedback on me, and it was positive. Then I don't know why she doesn't have the confidence in me and entrust me with more responsibility?!
I fear talking to the CEO too as he thinks that she's a God-sent Angel! And if I talk to him directly about initiatives, I fear he might eventually consult her, and she will shoot down my ideas under some vague pretext or the other or simply even tell him that she's already working on it and will roll it out at an appropriate time or worse say that they are not good ideas. I'm due for confirmation next month, and I don't want to jeopardize it.
I'm lost! Help, please.
From India, Delhi
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Well, I work in an ad agency. So, I report to the Head HR who reports to the CEO. I have a dotted line reporting to the Delhi Head and work closely with him. He also reports to the CEO.
The problem is that each time I tried to take her advice on initiatives, she replied by saying, "I am planning to do this, I am talking to people to get this done, I will roll it out in a few months' time, don't worry, I already have it on my agenda and I will do it sometime soon." Of course, she says all this very sweetly. We were both hired through a common headhunter, and I'd shared my problem with him, and he had a word with her. The result of that was just sweet talk but no concrete action. She did praise me as well and told me when she heard my appreciation from anyone but never in writing. I have asked her for feedback on me, and it was positive. Then I don't know why she doesn't have the confidence in me and entrust me with more responsibility?!
I fear talking to the CEO too as he thinks that she's a God-sent Angel! And if I talk to him directly about initiatives, I fear he might eventually consult her, and she will shoot down my ideas under some vague pretext or the other or simply even tell him that she's already working on it and will roll it out at an appropriate time or worse say that they are not good ideas. I'm due for confirmation next month, and I don't want to jeopardize it.
I'm lost! Help, please.
From India, Delhi
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The problem is that each time I tried to take her advice on initiatives, she replied by saying, "I am planning to do this, I am talking to people to get this done, I will roll it out in a few months' time, don't worry, I already have it on my agenda and I will do it sometime soon." Of course, she says all this very sweetly. We were both hired through a common headhunter, and I'd shared my problem with him, and he had a word with her. The result of that was just sweet talk but no concrete action. She did praise me as well and told me when she heard my appreciation from anyone but never in writing. I have asked her for feedback on me, and it was positive. Then I don't know why she doesn't have the confidence in me and entrust me with more responsibility?!
I fear talking to the CEO too as he thinks that she's a God-sent Angel! And if I talk to him directly about initiatives, I fear he might eventually consult her, and she will shoot down my ideas under some vague pretext or the other or simply even tell him that she's already working on it and will roll it out at an appropriate time or worse say that they are not good ideas. I'm due for confirmation next month, and I don't want to jeopardize it.
I'm lost! Help, please.
From India, Delhi
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Hi,
I believe that you have entered into a tough position. This is not really a problem that can remain untackled. A little bit of prudence will get you through. Here is how:
a. Keep your superboss in the loop: Try approaching your superboss. In case he/she is all ears to you. You can try convincing him/her about your ability. Now this will take some hard work and groundwork from your end. Design proposals/presentations keeping in mind the WITFM (What's in it for me?) factor. Remember there is no surrogate to documentation.
b. The squeaky wheel gets the grease: Blowing your own trumpet and communicating/documenting it through emails is most important since your boss is located in Mumbai.
If you think that you have done a job well and duly deserve praise/reward, then you have to follow up with her till the finish. It will either get implemented, or you will have to deal with new challenges to resolve before it gets implemented. Remember these boundaries are drawn by the mind alone. You just need to think that your boss is your own subordinate, and you need to follow up with her/him. This will allow you to deal with him/her patiently.
c. Get more ears for yourself: Since your boss sits in Delhi, you actually have the freedom to work. I am sure you also have a business reporting at Delhi as well. Even if not, they are your ultimate clients. It is important to get them to appreciate your stance. You have to get their buy-in as well. Try working on those HR verticals which are of prime concern to the Business Heads (You need to have a fair understanding of the business). This would make you indispensable. Try becoming a solutions provider. For example, say that you are in an NBFC, your targets should be quick recruitments within minimal TAT and attrition. Since you are the one who ultimately helps the Sales Manager get high performers to meet their targets. Even if your function reporting is not interested in your welfare, the business reporting will support you. This will give you immense power, but remember to use it wisely as the rise is fast but the fall is even faster.
Here's something that IT has taught me. Start off something (HR initiative) on a small scale, and if it succeeds, then you can go ahead and get the approval for it to be implemented nationally. This will provide concrete data to work with and help you in moving up in your career.
d. Incompetence: In careers, people rise to their level of incompetence. It seems that the same is true for your boss. Policies get stuck at the top management's desk; people like your boss are unable to convince them. The strategy lies not in changing them but to change yourself. Put yourself in their shoes and try to anticipate the bottlenecks which come in the way of its approval and find solutions to them. Thus, there would be no logical reason/argument not to implement those policies. This will give the senior management relief, and doing this periodically will help you gain their trust and hence their ears.
Do write in to let me know how you plan to resolve this issue and within what timelines. In case you have any queries, you can write to me.
Warm Regards,
Shyamali
From India, Nasik
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I believe that you have entered into a tough position. This is not really a problem that can remain untackled. A little bit of prudence will get you through. Here is how:
a. Keep your superboss in the loop: Try approaching your superboss. In case he/she is all ears to you. You can try convincing him/her about your ability. Now this will take some hard work and groundwork from your end. Design proposals/presentations keeping in mind the WITFM (What's in it for me?) factor. Remember there is no surrogate to documentation.
b. The squeaky wheel gets the grease: Blowing your own trumpet and communicating/documenting it through emails is most important since your boss is located in Mumbai.
If you think that you have done a job well and duly deserve praise/reward, then you have to follow up with her till the finish. It will either get implemented, or you will have to deal with new challenges to resolve before it gets implemented. Remember these boundaries are drawn by the mind alone. You just need to think that your boss is your own subordinate, and you need to follow up with her/him. This will allow you to deal with him/her patiently.
c. Get more ears for yourself: Since your boss sits in Delhi, you actually have the freedom to work. I am sure you also have a business reporting at Delhi as well. Even if not, they are your ultimate clients. It is important to get them to appreciate your stance. You have to get their buy-in as well. Try working on those HR verticals which are of prime concern to the Business Heads (You need to have a fair understanding of the business). This would make you indispensable. Try becoming a solutions provider. For example, say that you are in an NBFC, your targets should be quick recruitments within minimal TAT and attrition. Since you are the one who ultimately helps the Sales Manager get high performers to meet their targets. Even if your function reporting is not interested in your welfare, the business reporting will support you. This will give you immense power, but remember to use it wisely as the rise is fast but the fall is even faster.
Here's something that IT has taught me. Start off something (HR initiative) on a small scale, and if it succeeds, then you can go ahead and get the approval for it to be implemented nationally. This will provide concrete data to work with and help you in moving up in your career.
d. Incompetence: In careers, people rise to their level of incompetence. It seems that the same is true for your boss. Policies get stuck at the top management's desk; people like your boss are unable to convince them. The strategy lies not in changing them but to change yourself. Put yourself in their shoes and try to anticipate the bottlenecks which come in the way of its approval and find solutions to them. Thus, there would be no logical reason/argument not to implement those policies. This will give the senior management relief, and doing this periodically will help you gain their trust and hence their ears.
Do write in to let me know how you plan to resolve this issue and within what timelines. In case you have any queries, you can write to me.
Warm Regards,
Shyamali
From India, Nasik
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Dear All,
I was offered by my present company when i was doing great job with my previous company.
I joined the company bcz they offered me good position with good job responsibilities ( JV between Sinagapore & Inida – It's a start up company). I took the challenge and started my career, even though i do know that i have to face several challenges ahead. (51% share from Indian Govt based company and rest from Singapore based company).
We have a simple Org chart. SVP (From IBC) - VP (From SBC) - AVP (From IBC)
The one who offered me went back to Singapore bcz of their project completion. New staff was deployed in their vacancies.
My reporting boss doesn't know much about HR functions. As he was deputed from IBC one of the JV Company as AVP F&Corp Services.” In his view HR means PR only“.
I tried explaining several times about HR functions but he is not ready to listen. He always compares the HR work with his mother company PR dept.
After 20 days of his joining he gave me Transfer letter from corporate to operations department. (Big Surprise)
Copy of JR is not provided and even the reason for transfer is not given.
I asked him the reasons for transfer? He simply said Mgt wants you to handle certain things in Operations which are related to HR.
I am not clear with what he said but i understood that i should look for opportunity .... But i feel very bad with the process he followed.
Hope you agree with me with the pathetic situation in market.
Today morning i received a call from my AVP F&CS, i meet him and he says Mgt took a decision and asked him to convey me “To put down my papers".
I asked them the reasons on the same they don't have 1 single reason to give.
Why this happened? I think i am very straight forward with my SVP and my new boss who don't know much about HR. ( bcz earlier exp he had in Finance dept )
I am not willing too stay in this company. But as per the outside market even i feel it will take some time for getting good opportunity. I don't want to take any sort of risk in my future carer.
I need your inputs on this ...
Should i resign? (I don't have any reason from Mgt)??????:icon1:
Waiting for your response!!!
HR - Raj
From India, Hyderabad
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I was offered by my present company when i was doing great job with my previous company.
I joined the company bcz they offered me good position with good job responsibilities ( JV between Sinagapore & Inida – It's a start up company). I took the challenge and started my career, even though i do know that i have to face several challenges ahead. (51% share from Indian Govt based company and rest from Singapore based company).
We have a simple Org chart. SVP (From IBC) - VP (From SBC) - AVP (From IBC)
The one who offered me went back to Singapore bcz of their project completion. New staff was deployed in their vacancies.
My reporting boss doesn't know much about HR functions. As he was deputed from IBC one of the JV Company as AVP F&Corp Services.” In his view HR means PR only“.
I tried explaining several times about HR functions but he is not ready to listen. He always compares the HR work with his mother company PR dept.
After 20 days of his joining he gave me Transfer letter from corporate to operations department. (Big Surprise)
Copy of JR is not provided and even the reason for transfer is not given.
I asked him the reasons for transfer? He simply said Mgt wants you to handle certain things in Operations which are related to HR.
I am not clear with what he said but i understood that i should look for opportunity .... But i feel very bad with the process he followed.
Hope you agree with me with the pathetic situation in market.
Today morning i received a call from my AVP F&CS, i meet him and he says Mgt took a decision and asked him to convey me “To put down my papers".
I asked them the reasons on the same they don't have 1 single reason to give.
Why this happened? I think i am very straight forward with my SVP and my new boss who don't know much about HR. ( bcz earlier exp he had in Finance dept )
I am not willing too stay in this company. But as per the outside market even i feel it will take some time for getting good opportunity. I don't want to take any sort of risk in my future carer.
I need your inputs on this ...
Should i resign? (I don't have any reason from Mgt)??????:icon1:
Waiting for your response!!!
HR - Raj
From India, Hyderabad
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Thank you all for your help and support.
Shyamali, I think you're right. I should try to get some support from the business side and perhaps initiate ideas that are non-threatening to my boss and Finance. This would indeed be very challenging for me because they also don't see much use of HR and do not have an understanding of what HR is supposed to do, marginalizing my role at every opportunity they get. They never consult me on people issues or hiring.
When I did try to speak with the Delhi Head on some of the initiatives, but he told me that I have very high and different expectations and that ''this is advertising and will never function like a true corporate''. I think that's what made me lose morale and motivation to keep going.
It's just that it's very hard to remain self-motivated, and sometimes it feels like I'm banging my head against a wall.
Some employees, however, do approach me for various issues, but I am unable to help them most of the time because either the issue comes under Finance's purview or Mumbai HR/Corp HR. I am part of the Corp HR team but sitting in Delhi, and everything is centralized.
In my previous organization, I was handling end-to-end recruitments, but here, I do not have any say in vendor management. Everything is either centralized or with Finance.
I am afraid to talk to the Delhi Head about initiatives because I think he too doesn't have any understanding of how HR can add value. His style is very informal and he likes to handle everything himself, except when it involves paperwork. I've been here for almost 5 months, and I haven't been asked for a single update or report on anything!
Sighhhh...
From India, Delhi
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Shyamali, I think you're right. I should try to get some support from the business side and perhaps initiate ideas that are non-threatening to my boss and Finance. This would indeed be very challenging for me because they also don't see much use of HR and do not have an understanding of what HR is supposed to do, marginalizing my role at every opportunity they get. They never consult me on people issues or hiring.
When I did try to speak with the Delhi Head on some of the initiatives, but he told me that I have very high and different expectations and that ''this is advertising and will never function like a true corporate''. I think that's what made me lose morale and motivation to keep going.
It's just that it's very hard to remain self-motivated, and sometimes it feels like I'm banging my head against a wall.
Some employees, however, do approach me for various issues, but I am unable to help them most of the time because either the issue comes under Finance's purview or Mumbai HR/Corp HR. I am part of the Corp HR team but sitting in Delhi, and everything is centralized.
In my previous organization, I was handling end-to-end recruitments, but here, I do not have any say in vendor management. Everything is either centralized or with Finance.
I am afraid to talk to the Delhi Head about initiatives because I think he too doesn't have any understanding of how HR can add value. His style is very informal and he likes to handle everything himself, except when it involves paperwork. I've been here for almost 5 months, and I haven't been asked for a single update or report on anything!
Sighhhh...
From India, Delhi
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Hi Arnold,
Even I have a boss who checks and rechecks the work done by all of us but delegates the work of Managers. On top of that, he will even instruct us to do it in a particular fashion, with no space given to us to prove ourselves. I don't think they deserve to be in the positions they hold. I am working at an executive level, and he has given me the responsibility of writing job profiles for the company. For the same work, an agency has demanded Rs. 3-5 Lakhs. I suggested various options, such as taking samples and writing job profiles or having H.O.D.s provide the job profiles of their respective departments. However, what he prefers is for me to write the job profile, then he will check and recheck, deriving sadistic pleasure from it. I would like to add that the company is a 16-year-old organization. Furthermore, he is a "YES PERSON," meaning whenever any senior or junior staff, or even the peons, need something or are not doing their work, he would say, "no, we have to do it; it is our job." Now, how should I deal with this boss? He is a V.P. and makes us feel even lower than peons, not wanting to provide any facilities to us because he says we are facilitators. His idea of a facilitator is to give facilities to people, whereas, if I know, the idea of a facilitator is one who helps to fulfill the tasks with available resources. My definition may not be entirely correct, but I hope you all understand what I mean to say.
This whole situation arose because I thought to save the company's money and told him that we will do it ourselves. People before me were much more diplomatic, and they never offered to make any changes in the organization because of our YES PERSON boss.
However, I don't let all this dampen my spirits; if we don't know what is bad, then we cannot appreciate what is good.
Any suggestions, folks, on what should be done in case you have such a boss?
I'm glad I joined this site. I cannot discuss all this at home because they will not understand a thing, you know.
:confused: Kiran
From India, Mumbai
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Even I have a boss who checks and rechecks the work done by all of us but delegates the work of Managers. On top of that, he will even instruct us to do it in a particular fashion, with no space given to us to prove ourselves. I don't think they deserve to be in the positions they hold. I am working at an executive level, and he has given me the responsibility of writing job profiles for the company. For the same work, an agency has demanded Rs. 3-5 Lakhs. I suggested various options, such as taking samples and writing job profiles or having H.O.D.s provide the job profiles of their respective departments. However, what he prefers is for me to write the job profile, then he will check and recheck, deriving sadistic pleasure from it. I would like to add that the company is a 16-year-old organization. Furthermore, he is a "YES PERSON," meaning whenever any senior or junior staff, or even the peons, need something or are not doing their work, he would say, "no, we have to do it; it is our job." Now, how should I deal with this boss? He is a V.P. and makes us feel even lower than peons, not wanting to provide any facilities to us because he says we are facilitators. His idea of a facilitator is to give facilities to people, whereas, if I know, the idea of a facilitator is one who helps to fulfill the tasks with available resources. My definition may not be entirely correct, but I hope you all understand what I mean to say.
This whole situation arose because I thought to save the company's money and told him that we will do it ourselves. People before me were much more diplomatic, and they never offered to make any changes in the organization because of our YES PERSON boss.
However, I don't let all this dampen my spirits; if we don't know what is bad, then we cannot appreciate what is good.
Any suggestions, folks, on what should be done in case you have such a boss?
I'm glad I joined this site. I cannot discuss all this at home because they will not understand a thing, you know.
:confused: Kiran
From India, Mumbai
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Hi,
Why is it that everywhere HR is not given importance? When it comes to implementing something, they say you do this and that. However, when it is done, there is no appreciation or importance given to it. HR plays a very important role in a company by taking care of all the employees, but it often operates on a low profile.
How can we continue to function on a low profile? Please suggest.
Regards,
Tabassum
From India, Calcutta
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Why is it that everywhere HR is not given importance? When it comes to implementing something, they say you do this and that. However, when it is done, there is no appreciation or importance given to it. HR plays a very important role in a company by taking care of all the employees, but it often operates on a low profile.
How can we continue to function on a low profile? Please suggest.
Regards,
Tabassum
From India, Calcutta
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I think mostly HR people have dug their own grave by being too uptight and following the rule book. Sadly, most of them have risen from positions of executive secretaries, receptionists, data entry operators, etc. That's why for them, HR means just paperwork, and that's how they exercise their power.
I started my career with sales in the biggest media house of India. The HR there sucked, sat on a different floor, and never bothered to interact with the staff. They were unapproachable and feared. I had some trouble with my boss at that time, and instead of approaching HR, I preferred to go to the Director instead. Since it was the beginning of my career, I was so determined to change the way HR functioned, and I thought I could do it only by being part of the function myself. So I made my move to HR. But sadly, in India, it is still at the mercy of the top management. I've come to the conclusion that perhaps the top guys don't want capable HR people to run the function. They just want 'yes people' and executioners, not strategists and thinkers. Most don't know what HR is supposed to do, and that's very unfortunate.
From India, Delhi
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I started my career with sales in the biggest media house of India. The HR there sucked, sat on a different floor, and never bothered to interact with the staff. They were unapproachable and feared. I had some trouble with my boss at that time, and instead of approaching HR, I preferred to go to the Director instead. Since it was the beginning of my career, I was so determined to change the way HR functioned, and I thought I could do it only by being part of the function myself. So I made my move to HR. But sadly, in India, it is still at the mercy of the top management. I've come to the conclusion that perhaps the top guys don't want capable HR people to run the function. They just want 'yes people' and executioners, not strategists and thinkers. Most don't know what HR is supposed to do, and that's very unfortunate.
From India, Delhi
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I did face the same problem in my last employment. I spoke to my manager, but that did not work, so I spoke to the CEO directly, who was my boss's boss. I received a good response from him initially, or I guess that's what they wanted me to feel, but then they slowly started building a case against me and started to make my life miserable. Moreover, I was pregnant then, and they did not want to bear maternity costs. Ultimately, I had to move out or be terminated. The lesson that I learned here is that don't try to bypass your boss; work through him. Another colleague of mine did that and is quite successful in the same organization. I hope this helps in getting a better understanding.
From India, Bangalore
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From India, Bangalore
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Thank you all for your help and support. When I did try to speak with the Delhi Head on some of the initiatives, he told me that I have very high and different expectations, and that "this is advertising and will never function like a true corporate." I think that's what made me lose morale and motivation to keep going.
Some employees, however, do approach me for various issues, but I am unable to help them most of the time because either the issue falls under Finance's purview or Mumbai HR/Corp HR. I am part of the Corp HR team but sitting in Delhi, and everything is centralized. In my previous organization, I was handling end-to-end recruitments, but here I do not have any say in vendor management. Everything is either centralized or with Finance.
I am afraid to talk to the Delhi Head about initiatives because I think he too doesn't have any understanding of how HR can add value. His style is very informal and he likes to handle everything himself except when it involves paperwork. I've been here for almost 5 months, and I haven't been asked for a single update/report on anything! Sighhh...
A small survey can help you understand the health of the organization. If you think that surveys will not reveal the true picture, then try chatting up with people to gauge what issues plague them. See how you can tackle them. Put your findings in a report along with the solutions. This will help you get better buy-in.
Here in Kolkata, the culture is very informal, but after speaking, the same needs to be communicated over an email. Now, how well you communicate depends on you. It can help you save yourself from unpleasantness.
I would like to know a little bit about the initiatives that you are keen to drive. I will help you get the buy-in.
From India, Nasik
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Some employees, however, do approach me for various issues, but I am unable to help them most of the time because either the issue falls under Finance's purview or Mumbai HR/Corp HR. I am part of the Corp HR team but sitting in Delhi, and everything is centralized. In my previous organization, I was handling end-to-end recruitments, but here I do not have any say in vendor management. Everything is either centralized or with Finance.
I am afraid to talk to the Delhi Head about initiatives because I think he too doesn't have any understanding of how HR can add value. His style is very informal and he likes to handle everything himself except when it involves paperwork. I've been here for almost 5 months, and I haven't been asked for a single update/report on anything! Sighhh...
A small survey can help you understand the health of the organization. If you think that surveys will not reveal the true picture, then try chatting up with people to gauge what issues plague them. See how you can tackle them. Put your findings in a report along with the solutions. This will help you get better buy-in.
Here in Kolkata, the culture is very informal, but after speaking, the same needs to be communicated over an email. Now, how well you communicate depends on you. It can help you save yourself from unpleasantness.
I would like to know a little bit about the initiatives that you are keen to drive. I will help you get the buy-in.
From India, Nasik
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Hi Karan,
I work in an Ad Agency myself and I understand what you are going through.
I am not aware of how the work environment is in your Ad Agency, but in the one I am working, HR used to be seen as a minimalistic department that would do paperwork only.
To bring about the required change, you'll have to play your cards right.
This is what I did when I joined about 2 years back:
Action: I went out and spoke to the people; I stopped being the lonely HR department.
Result: People began confiding in me. That way, I could make better plans for the employees.
Action: My reporting manager was of the opinion that HR was for recruitments only. I ran short-term plans like a change in the reporting time, feedback, etc.
Result: (Thankfully, these plans worked out.) When my manager saw the positive change brought about, he understood that HR is much more than typing out letters and hiring people.
I think at the end of the day all managers want their people to be happy. Prepare a presentation along with your reporting manager, present it in front of the CEO, sell him a dream: The dream that a happy employee equals increased productivity and increased productivity equals higher profits.
Do things differently but never let your reporting manager down; always keep him in the loop. Try hard to be extra pally and try to work as a team. Remember, at the end of the day, you wish to be an effective HR, and an effective HR always promotes a feeling of 'well-being.'
All the best. Don't lose hope yet. These are initial hiccups; you'll have to be stronger than that.
Regards,
Manju
From India, New Delhi
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I work in an Ad Agency myself and I understand what you are going through.
I am not aware of how the work environment is in your Ad Agency, but in the one I am working, HR used to be seen as a minimalistic department that would do paperwork only.
To bring about the required change, you'll have to play your cards right.
This is what I did when I joined about 2 years back:
Action: I went out and spoke to the people; I stopped being the lonely HR department.
Result: People began confiding in me. That way, I could make better plans for the employees.
Action: My reporting manager was of the opinion that HR was for recruitments only. I ran short-term plans like a change in the reporting time, feedback, etc.
Result: (Thankfully, these plans worked out.) When my manager saw the positive change brought about, he understood that HR is much more than typing out letters and hiring people.
I think at the end of the day all managers want their people to be happy. Prepare a presentation along with your reporting manager, present it in front of the CEO, sell him a dream: The dream that a happy employee equals increased productivity and increased productivity equals higher profits.
Do things differently but never let your reporting manager down; always keep him in the loop. Try hard to be extra pally and try to work as a team. Remember, at the end of the day, you wish to be an effective HR, and an effective HR always promotes a feeling of 'well-being.'
All the best. Don't lose hope yet. These are initial hiccups; you'll have to be stronger than that.
Regards,
Manju
From India, New Delhi
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As long as HR cannot both contribute and show that it is contributing to the business it can never achive the status that it wants to.
From India, Nasik
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From India, Nasik
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DEAR SENIOR’S, KINDLY, SUGGEST ME TO KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ENGINEERING COMPANY AND MANUFACTURING COMPANY. k.SELVI
From India, Madras
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From India, Madras
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Well, Friend,
It is very tough to survive in a situation where most people are unaware of the basics of your core functions. In fact, a lot of time is spent showing the importance and reason for the existence of your job and department, respectively, rather than doing some innovative work.
Previously, I was facing the same problem. I mean, my boss was not delegating work to me. I myself started some new work and sent it to him. He did not even respond. Then, I got a chance to meet the CEO on his official tour. I straightforwardly told him about the poor position of HR and informed him that I want to work on organizational development. Not only did he permit me, but he also ordered me to send it to him directly. I myself made a cc to my boss, and now I am in a situation where I can work independently, and my boss is now aware that I can not only do work but also can contact his boss.
I would suggest you act upon the same.
High regards,
SAM
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It is very tough to survive in a situation where most people are unaware of the basics of your core functions. In fact, a lot of time is spent showing the importance and reason for the existence of your job and department, respectively, rather than doing some innovative work.
Previously, I was facing the same problem. I mean, my boss was not delegating work to me. I myself started some new work and sent it to him. He did not even respond. Then, I got a chance to meet the CEO on his official tour. I straightforwardly told him about the poor position of HR and informed him that I want to work on organizational development. Not only did he permit me, but he also ordered me to send it to him directly. I myself made a cc to my boss, and now I am in a situation where I can work independently, and my boss is now aware that I can not only do work but also can contact his boss.
I would suggest you act upon the same.
High regards,
SAM
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Hi,
This is not only your problem; many of our colleagues are facing similar issues today. You are just one among them. Don't bother about it at all.
Your boss lacks basics in professional management. He is merely a money gatherer who hired you for the sake of showing they have an HR department.
You cannot continue in such poorly managed organizations. They turn a deaf ear when you talk about professionalism. I suggest you to move on from that low-standard workplace. Hopefully, you will search for a better job that suits you.
"Be king in hell than a servant in heaven" :-D
Regards,
N.V. Rao
From India, Delhi
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This is not only your problem; many of our colleagues are facing similar issues today. You are just one among them. Don't bother about it at all.
Your boss lacks basics in professional management. He is merely a money gatherer who hired you for the sake of showing they have an HR department.
You cannot continue in such poorly managed organizations. They turn a deaf ear when you talk about professionalism. I suggest you to move on from that low-standard workplace. Hopefully, you will search for a better job that suits you.
"Be king in hell than a servant in heaven" :-D
Regards,
N.V. Rao
From India, Delhi
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Hi Shyamali/Manju,
The initiatives I want to drive include conducting a talent audit, an employee satisfaction survey, and establishing a recruitment process. Additionally, I aim to focus on resource planning and conducting training needs analysis.
I actively engage with employees and am rarely confined to my seat. I conduct exit interviews and forward the feedback to my boss. However, during our discussions, I discovered that she does not even read the reports; they are simply filed away.
One critical issue I addressed was the delay in salary and reimbursement payments. Salaries often arrived late, sometimes as delayed as the 6th or 7th of the month, which I find unacceptable. The Finance department handles payroll, and for the first three months, they provided vague excuses. It appeared that I was the only one raising concerns about delayed payments. Upon speaking with others, many expressed dissatisfaction as their EMI checks were bouncing, resulting in fines. Despite urging Finance to act promptly, they suggested employees take loans if needed and mentioned a potential six-month timeline to streamline the process. I pointed out the legal requirement to pay salaries by the 7th and emphasized the need for professionalism by ensuring payments by the 30th of the month.
To address the issue, I advised dissatisfied employees to email me their concerns. After compiling their feedback, I escalated the matter to the Finance department. Subsequently, with my boss and the CEO involved, the problem was resolved that month. However, the Finance representative contacted each dissatisfied employee individually, implying HR's powerlessness and emphasizing that all issues should be directed to him. The Finance team received praise for "fixing the problem," yet no acknowledgment was extended to me.
One day, while sharing my frustrations with a colleague, she remarked that I was overly honest in my approach, which might not be appreciated in our current environment. She noted that despite my efforts, the employees I was advocating for may not reciprocate the same level of concern.
Despite these challenges, I agree that maintaining hope and persistence is crucial in continuing the fight for necessary changes.
From India, Delhi
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The initiatives I want to drive include conducting a talent audit, an employee satisfaction survey, and establishing a recruitment process. Additionally, I aim to focus on resource planning and conducting training needs analysis.
I actively engage with employees and am rarely confined to my seat. I conduct exit interviews and forward the feedback to my boss. However, during our discussions, I discovered that she does not even read the reports; they are simply filed away.
One critical issue I addressed was the delay in salary and reimbursement payments. Salaries often arrived late, sometimes as delayed as the 6th or 7th of the month, which I find unacceptable. The Finance department handles payroll, and for the first three months, they provided vague excuses. It appeared that I was the only one raising concerns about delayed payments. Upon speaking with others, many expressed dissatisfaction as their EMI checks were bouncing, resulting in fines. Despite urging Finance to act promptly, they suggested employees take loans if needed and mentioned a potential six-month timeline to streamline the process. I pointed out the legal requirement to pay salaries by the 7th and emphasized the need for professionalism by ensuring payments by the 30th of the month.
To address the issue, I advised dissatisfied employees to email me their concerns. After compiling their feedback, I escalated the matter to the Finance department. Subsequently, with my boss and the CEO involved, the problem was resolved that month. However, the Finance representative contacted each dissatisfied employee individually, implying HR's powerlessness and emphasizing that all issues should be directed to him. The Finance team received praise for "fixing the problem," yet no acknowledgment was extended to me.
One day, while sharing my frustrations with a colleague, she remarked that I was overly honest in my approach, which might not be appreciated in our current environment. She noted that despite my efforts, the employees I was advocating for may not reciprocate the same level of concern.
Despite these challenges, I agree that maintaining hope and persistence is crucial in continuing the fight for necessary changes.
From India, Delhi
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Hi Karan,
Just got to know from your email that you have started the HR practices and operations of your company from scratch, though it's difficult for it to get implemented due to certain issues with the top management. I'm presently in a similar situation of setting up HR from scratch. Kindly tell me how you carried on with doing what you did in your company. I'm a new joiner in a trading company in Oman. I do not have previous generalist HR experience. Here, they have asked me to set up a proper HR division (practices) for the company. The company has around 150 employees, and in the current system, the employee files, leave handling, etc., are done manually, with the payroll being handled by the finance department. We wish to organize the employee files and related HR practices (from joining formalities till employee leaving the organization) so that one-point access can be achieved, thus saving time. Please provide me with a framework on how to proceed regarding this and examples of the areas to be covered, along with sufficient spreadsheets.
Kindly respond to this as soon as possible.
Thanks and regards,
Lakshmi
From Oman, Muscat
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Just got to know from your email that you have started the HR practices and operations of your company from scratch, though it's difficult for it to get implemented due to certain issues with the top management. I'm presently in a similar situation of setting up HR from scratch. Kindly tell me how you carried on with doing what you did in your company. I'm a new joiner in a trading company in Oman. I do not have previous generalist HR experience. Here, they have asked me to set up a proper HR division (practices) for the company. The company has around 150 employees, and in the current system, the employee files, leave handling, etc., are done manually, with the payroll being handled by the finance department. We wish to organize the employee files and related HR practices (from joining formalities till employee leaving the organization) so that one-point access can be achieved, thus saving time. Please provide me with a framework on how to proceed regarding this and examples of the areas to be covered, along with sufficient spreadsheets.
Kindly respond to this as soon as possible.
Thanks and regards,
Lakshmi
From Oman, Muscat
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Non-delegator bosses are very easy to find and are everywhere, almost in all organizations and mostly in the HR line. This is because HR, as a terminology, is a new concept for Indians, and since the last couple of years, HR professionals have been entering the market. Traditional org's who have established an HR department for the sake of a name recruited anyone - unqualified, undeserving individuals. Now, when these individuals become bosses of educated and professional individuals, they become insecure because they know that this generation is quite advanced in knowledge and can accomplish more in comparison to them. The new generation is well-versed in the latest terms and concepts. The only way these bosses can survive is by leading without giving clear replies. Additionally, a typical quality is to satisfy their ego by hiring educated individuals like MBAs so that they can proudly say that they are leading a team of MBAs. I suggest not bringing this issue to the attention of the CEO, as he himself may not be aware of what HR is capable of. He would only hear about your boss, and then you may face difficulties. This is a challenging time for you. You have two options: wait for your boss to leave (if you think she can find another job) or start looking for a job where capabilities are nurtured. However, you need to keep in mind that this scenario may persist for another 5-7 years until educated and qualified individuals rise to the top. Until then, maintain patience. This is the scenario in most organizations; you are not the only one suffering.
From India
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From India
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Hi Ratty, thanks for understanding my situation and actually nailing the problem! I also feel the same.
I wonder if I'll be able to find an HR role where I can actually get the satisfaction of working and making a difference! Sometimes I think the only place where I can be a true HR professional is somewhere abroad.
From India, Delhi
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I wonder if I'll be able to find an HR role where I can actually get the satisfaction of working and making a difference! Sometimes I think the only place where I can be a true HR professional is somewhere abroad.
From India, Delhi
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Hi Arnold, this is the case everywhere. no need to go abroad, just we need to work with companies where HR is developed and have systems and top management supports HR
From India
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From India
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Hi Ratty, you've mentioned that one way of handling such bosses is to not give them clear replies. Could you please elaborate on that? So far, I've spoken my mind and shared all the info with my boss. I am aware of a lot of subordinates who make their boss' life miserable by not sharing info or not cooperating. If this is what you meant, please let me know how one can do it effectively without jeopardizing one's job. Please remember that my boss is well-liked by my CEO!
From India, Delhi
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From India, Delhi
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