Seeking Guidance for Career Development
My daughter completed her CA on the first attempt in November 2013 and opted to go for IIM. Unfortunately, she was not able to secure a seat in the college of her choice, so she decided not to pursue an MBA. She accepted that she had not taken it seriously. Then she started looking for a job in Pune and Mumbai but was not able to pass interviews for 3-4 companies. She lost interest in attending interviews and nowadays is not even applying for any openings.
Now she has enrolled for CFA and is currently preparing for the November exam. Throughout her educational career, she was always at the top rank. She passed her SSC, HSC, and B.COM with distinction. I have tried my best to convince her, but all in vain.
Seeking Recommendations for Interview Training
Can anyone suggest a reputable institute where she can learn interview techniques and develop her personality? There are many institutes I can see online, but I am looking for the best one in Pune or Mumbai.
I would appreciate it if any member from a finance background could help her by suggesting openings available in their company. During her articleship, she was considered the best among their group. She completed her articleship at one of the top firms in Pune.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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12My daughter completed her CA on the first attempt in November 2013 and opted to go for IIM. Unfortunately, she was not able to secure a seat in the college of her choice, so she decided not to pursue an MBA. She accepted that she had not taken it seriously. Then she started looking for a job in Pune and Mumbai but was not able to pass interviews for 3-4 companies. She lost interest in attending interviews and nowadays is not even applying for any openings.
Now she has enrolled for CFA and is currently preparing for the November exam. Throughout her educational career, she was always at the top rank. She passed her SSC, HSC, and B.COM with distinction. I have tried my best to convince her, but all in vain.
Seeking Recommendations for Interview Training
Can anyone suggest a reputable institute where she can learn interview techniques and develop her personality? There are many institutes I can see online, but I am looking for the best one in Pune or Mumbai.
I would appreciate it if any member from a finance background could help her by suggesting openings available in their company. During her articleship, she was considered the best among their group. She completed her articleship at one of the top firms in Pune.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Dear Mr. Vijay,
After reviewing the entire case of your daughter, I can infer that what she needs is counseling. Therefore, I recommend that you seek help from a professional counselor. Finance professionals may not be adept at career counseling. If you were from Bangalore, I would have recommended a very good counselor who could have enhanced her self-esteem.
Secondly, you have not mentioned why your daughter could not succeed in the job interview even though she had been a top ranker throughout her education.
General Comments
The story of the poster's daughter shows that bookish knowledge does not build one's personality. This issue partially stems from our education system. Our education system tends to make students focus solely on examinations, neglecting other aspects. Most written examinations last for three hours, so students mainly learn to manage those 180 minutes of their lives. However, what our education system lacks is the practical application of knowledge. When students are unsure where, when, and how to apply their knowledge, they develop a fear of failure. Students' minds should not be treated as mere receptacles of knowledge. Our education system has yet to realize this. In contrast, Western countries emphasize using others' knowledge to thrive.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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After reviewing the entire case of your daughter, I can infer that what she needs is counseling. Therefore, I recommend that you seek help from a professional counselor. Finance professionals may not be adept at career counseling. If you were from Bangalore, I would have recommended a very good counselor who could have enhanced her self-esteem.
Secondly, you have not mentioned why your daughter could not succeed in the job interview even though she had been a top ranker throughout her education.
General Comments
The story of the poster's daughter shows that bookish knowledge does not build one's personality. This issue partially stems from our education system. Our education system tends to make students focus solely on examinations, neglecting other aspects. Most written examinations last for three hours, so students mainly learn to manage those 180 minutes of their lives. However, what our education system lacks is the practical application of knowledge. When students are unsure where, when, and how to apply their knowledge, they develop a fear of failure. Students' minds should not be treated as mere receptacles of knowledge. Our education system has yet to realize this. In contrast, Western countries emphasize using others' knowledge to thrive.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
From India, Bangalore
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I join other members in sharing your concern about your daughter. Her academic background and the current situation, as you described, don't seem to align in a few aspects. There are a few points that need clarity.
1. **Non-Academic Interests and Hobbies**
What are her non-academic interests or hobbies? Please mention whether she has been a bookworm while studying, if she ever had any friends in school or college as well as outside, and if she participated in any extra-curricular activities at school or college.
2. **Confidence and Academic Decisions**
Prima facie, she seems to have a semblance of over-confidence thus far—not very uncommon in top-scoring students. This is corroborated by what you mentioned: "she was not able to secure the seat in the college of her choice so decided not to go for an MBA" and "She accepted that she has not taken it seriously." Quite often, such top-notch students take things for granted in whatever they do until they get hit by reality that the efforts have to match the goals, irrespective of past achievements.
3. **Discussion and Interests**
Did you have a clear and open discussion with her? Is her interest towards a job or academics? I clearly see a sign (I may be wrong, but think I am right) of family pressure to get into a job rather than pursuing further studies. You mentioned she is preparing for CFA Exams in November; then what does this line of yours "I have tried my best to convince her but all in vain" mean? Convince for or against what?
4. **Need for Personality Development**
What's the basis on which you conclude that she has the need to develop her personality? Frankly, many parents think they know their children's aspirations and interests the best—based on their views of life. And quite often, they realize that they were wrong after it's too late—that what's good for the goose may not necessarily be good for the gander.
The pity in the whole situation is that the parents surely and definitely have the interest of the child in mind—so the intent is not and never is suspect—only the failure to see that the goals and methods could be different. And the other pitiable aspect in this is that no child, unless there's been any past history of child abuse or disregard, likes to say 'no' to his or her parents when he or she knows what's in their minds. Typically, they just 'keep shut', which actually leads to the whole issue taking different turns and possible wrong diagnosis of the situation.
I am not saying this from theory—I have practical experiences of having handled such situations (some which I managed to avert or correct well in time and some I just had to watch when whole careers or lives were literally going for a toss). Frankly, at this point in time, I don't see any need for any counseling or special courses. Please give your responses to the above queries.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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1. **Non-Academic Interests and Hobbies**
What are her non-academic interests or hobbies? Please mention whether she has been a bookworm while studying, if she ever had any friends in school or college as well as outside, and if she participated in any extra-curricular activities at school or college.
2. **Confidence and Academic Decisions**
Prima facie, she seems to have a semblance of over-confidence thus far—not very uncommon in top-scoring students. This is corroborated by what you mentioned: "she was not able to secure the seat in the college of her choice so decided not to go for an MBA" and "She accepted that she has not taken it seriously." Quite often, such top-notch students take things for granted in whatever they do until they get hit by reality that the efforts have to match the goals, irrespective of past achievements.
3. **Discussion and Interests**
Did you have a clear and open discussion with her? Is her interest towards a job or academics? I clearly see a sign (I may be wrong, but think I am right) of family pressure to get into a job rather than pursuing further studies. You mentioned she is preparing for CFA Exams in November; then what does this line of yours "I have tried my best to convince her but all in vain" mean? Convince for or against what?
4. **Need for Personality Development**
What's the basis on which you conclude that she has the need to develop her personality? Frankly, many parents think they know their children's aspirations and interests the best—based on their views of life. And quite often, they realize that they were wrong after it's too late—that what's good for the goose may not necessarily be good for the gander.
The pity in the whole situation is that the parents surely and definitely have the interest of the child in mind—so the intent is not and never is suspect—only the failure to see that the goals and methods could be different. And the other pitiable aspect in this is that no child, unless there's been any past history of child abuse or disregard, likes to say 'no' to his or her parents when he or she knows what's in their minds. Typically, they just 'keep shut', which actually leads to the whole issue taking different turns and possible wrong diagnosis of the situation.
I am not saying this from theory—I have practical experiences of having handled such situations (some which I managed to avert or correct well in time and some I just had to watch when whole careers or lives were literally going for a toss). Frankly, at this point in time, I don't see any need for any counseling or special courses. Please give your responses to the above queries.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Vijay, Our learned members have given good suggestions and raised valid questions; please let me add a couple of questions before making a comment. Has your daughter asked for feedback from the companies as to why she was not successful? In the West, most companies respond if asked. As I left India long ago, I do not know if organizations give such feedback. However, it's worth trying.
Has she tried in the company where she did her "articleship"? If not, why not?
If I am correct, 90% plus seats in IIMs are bagged by students with an engineering background, and thus the competition is very stiff. Kindly read and digest the info at http://www.business-standard.com/art...1501262_1.html.
It's very easy to lose heart when faced with failure for top-ranked students. However, your daughter should not fall into the vicious cycle.
For the time being, let her concentrate on the CFA exam if that's what she prefers.
Like others have mentioned, in India, parents try to influence what children have to do and also keep stressing on becoming a TOPPER in the class. However, my experience in the West is to let children do what they want and not compare them with others and not expect them to become TOPPERS.
Regards
From United Kingdom
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Has she tried in the company where she did her "articleship"? If not, why not?
If I am correct, 90% plus seats in IIMs are bagged by students with an engineering background, and thus the competition is very stiff. Kindly read and digest the info at http://www.business-standard.com/art...1501262_1.html.
It's very easy to lose heart when faced with failure for top-ranked students. However, your daughter should not fall into the vicious cycle.
For the time being, let her concentrate on the CFA exam if that's what she prefers.
Like others have mentioned, in India, parents try to influence what children have to do and also keep stressing on becoming a TOPPER in the class. However, my experience in the West is to let children do what they want and not compare them with others and not expect them to become TOPPERS.
Regards
From United Kingdom
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Feedback from Companies: A Reality Check
Regarding your comment, "Has your daughter asked for feedback from the companies as to why she was not successful?" — forget about it. Most companies in India don't even provide meaningful feedback to those who refer candidates (including agencies), let alone the interviewees themselves. I emphasized "meaningful" because terms like "technically rejected" or "not selected" can be vague. Some companies do not consider the feelings of individuals; they use "rejected" as casually as they use "selected," despite other ways to communicate the same message without discouraging the candidate. It seems that not all battles can be won until companies acknowledge their responsibility to interviewees.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Regarding your comment, "Has your daughter asked for feedback from the companies as to why she was not successful?" — forget about it. Most companies in India don't even provide meaningful feedback to those who refer candidates (including agencies), let alone the interviewees themselves. I emphasized "meaningful" because terms like "technically rejected" or "not selected" can be vague. Some companies do not consider the feelings of individuals; they use "rejected" as casually as they use "selected," despite other ways to communicate the same message without discouraging the candidate. It seems that not all battles can be won until companies acknowledge their responsibility to interviewees.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear TS,
Our daughter is a family physician, and General Practices generally give feedback when asked. The same goes for some companies.
Dear Nathrao and TS,
You are both right. Until companies realize that even in a buyer's market, they owe some explanation to rejected candidates on how they could improve their chances of selection, things will not change. The candidates get frustrated.
From United Kingdom
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Our daughter is a family physician, and General Practices generally give feedback when asked. The same goes for some companies.
Dear Nathrao and TS,
You are both right. Until companies realize that even in a buyer's market, they owe some explanation to rejected candidates on how they could improve their chances of selection, things will not change. The candidates get frustrated.
From United Kingdom
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Just to add to what I mentioned/suggested earlier, though I am NOT a finance guy, by virtue of being in a profession where learning about the latest trends and disruptive sectors/fields is a necessity and daily routine rather than a hobby, I can say that CFA is not something that anyone can get through easily.
It's highly valued in top-notch companies—needless to say, it's also very tough to clear and is NOT for average students.
Here's the link for your ready reference:
CFA Program
In addition to the effort involved, the only other aspect that needs to be kept in mind would be the timeframes... it takes around 2 years to attain the CFA designation after one's name.
Though this may seem obtrusive, I would venture to add: when the kid is raring to fly, as a parent, it wouldn't be appropriate to hold him/her like a crab and keep pulling him/her to hold him/her down. The best current-day example for this would be Saina Nehwal...
Like V. Raghunathan mentioned, please do give your views.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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It's highly valued in top-notch companies—needless to say, it's also very tough to clear and is NOT for average students.
Here's the link for your ready reference:
CFA Program
In addition to the effort involved, the only other aspect that needs to be kept in mind would be the timeframes... it takes around 2 years to attain the CFA designation after one's name.
Though this may seem obtrusive, I would venture to add: when the kid is raring to fly, as a parent, it wouldn't be appropriate to hold him/her like a crab and keep pulling him/her to hold him/her down. The best current-day example for this would be Saina Nehwal...
Like V. Raghunathan mentioned, please do give your views.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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With a long history of training people in job search and interview skills, I can concur with most of the comments posted thus far.
The Challenge of Self-Confidence in Interviews
The issue of self-confidence and the ability to cope with interviews is a tricky one. Some people are natural talkers, while others are shy and reserved. There are no easy answers.
As others have pointed out, preparation is the key to success and will go a long way toward enabling a candidate to perform well. However, that really only works when employers have a proper set of questions based on the skills and experience needed to do the job. Then the candidate can prepare confidently based on the position description. However, too many interviewers go down the path of asking totally irrelevant questions that have nothing to do with the job in question. And there is this idiotic trend of asking things like how many cabs are there in New York City or something like that.
When faced with that sort of rubbish, it is not surprising that candidates fall in a heap and lose confidence. I am not disagreeing that candidates need to show the ability to think on their feet, be creative, and also show resilience. However, there are better ways of doing it.
Cultural Differences in Interview Preparation
I am not sure what it is like in India, but in the West, there is a growing tendency for parents to try and shield their children from hurt and disappointment. There are no winners and losers; everyone gets a prize, etc. Wrapping children in bubble wrap does nothing for their ability to cope with the real world, and that is sad.
I am sure every one of us here on CiteHR has been unsuccessful at more than one interview. We try to learn from our mistakes, pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and start all over again. It is part of our growth and development as human beings. It gives us the resilience to cope with the bigger disasters that can befall us along the way.
The Importance of Feedback
Finally, on the subject of feedback from interviews, many employers will not give feedback. That's a given. However, sometimes it is in the way you ask. I always tell people that if they decide to seek feedback, they should start by thanking the employer for the opportunity of the interview. Then, ask what they would need to do to be successful next time a position like this comes up. It won't always work, but sometimes it disarms the interviewer enough to coax them into giving some pointers. It goes without saying that you never burn your bridges. They may have liked you, but another candidate was stronger on THIS occasion.
Regards.
From Australia, Melbourne
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The Challenge of Self-Confidence in Interviews
The issue of self-confidence and the ability to cope with interviews is a tricky one. Some people are natural talkers, while others are shy and reserved. There are no easy answers.
As others have pointed out, preparation is the key to success and will go a long way toward enabling a candidate to perform well. However, that really only works when employers have a proper set of questions based on the skills and experience needed to do the job. Then the candidate can prepare confidently based on the position description. However, too many interviewers go down the path of asking totally irrelevant questions that have nothing to do with the job in question. And there is this idiotic trend of asking things like how many cabs are there in New York City or something like that.
When faced with that sort of rubbish, it is not surprising that candidates fall in a heap and lose confidence. I am not disagreeing that candidates need to show the ability to think on their feet, be creative, and also show resilience. However, there are better ways of doing it.
Cultural Differences in Interview Preparation
I am not sure what it is like in India, but in the West, there is a growing tendency for parents to try and shield their children from hurt and disappointment. There are no winners and losers; everyone gets a prize, etc. Wrapping children in bubble wrap does nothing for their ability to cope with the real world, and that is sad.
I am sure every one of us here on CiteHR has been unsuccessful at more than one interview. We try to learn from our mistakes, pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and start all over again. It is part of our growth and development as human beings. It gives us the resilience to cope with the bigger disasters that can befall us along the way.
The Importance of Feedback
Finally, on the subject of feedback from interviews, many employers will not give feedback. That's a given. However, sometimes it is in the way you ask. I always tell people that if they decide to seek feedback, they should start by thanking the employer for the opportunity of the interview. Then, ask what they would need to do to be successful next time a position like this comes up. It won't always work, but sometimes it disarms the interviewer enough to coax them into giving some pointers. It goes without saying that you never burn your bridges. They may have liked you, but another candidate was stronger on THIS occasion.
Regards.
From Australia, Melbourne
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I think the problem lies with the fact that your daughter has a sense of overconfidence, probably from the praise that you and your family heaped on her. She was the topper in school and college. Well, it is immaterial. Was she a top 10 ranked in CA? If not, she is at the same level, more or less, as thousands of other CAs looking for jobs in the market.
So, who told her that every company out there is just waiting to grab her? How did she get convinced that she would get a job in the first interview she gave? I suspect it was you. Today, the demand for freshers is low as experienced persons are available all over the place. Attending 20 interviews for a job is common.
From your post, it appears to me that the problem was created by you. You are stressing her interview skills, which means you are still thinking that she should have gotten the first job and that it's her interview skills alone that were the problem.
Now, first disabuse yourself of the fact that the job is easy to get. Explain to her that the longer she is out of a job, the more difficult it will be to get one. So she needs to get a job quickly, even if it's not what she was told is worthwhile for her to do.
Try to see if the firm she did articles with has a place for her.
If not, sit with her and go through recruitment adverts to see which one is worth applying for, and help her do that. Ensure that she goes with the understanding that she may not get the job and that attending more interviews is important for when she goes for the one she wants.
By the way, there will hardly be jobs for CFA in Pune.
Regards
From India, Mumbai
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So, who told her that every company out there is just waiting to grab her? How did she get convinced that she would get a job in the first interview she gave? I suspect it was you. Today, the demand for freshers is low as experienced persons are available all over the place. Attending 20 interviews for a job is common.
From your post, it appears to me that the problem was created by you. You are stressing her interview skills, which means you are still thinking that she should have gotten the first job and that it's her interview skills alone that were the problem.
Now, first disabuse yourself of the fact that the job is easy to get. Explain to her that the longer she is out of a job, the more difficult it will be to get one. So she needs to get a job quickly, even if it's not what she was told is worthwhile for her to do.
Try to see if the firm she did articles with has a place for her.
If not, sit with her and go through recruitment adverts to see which one is worth applying for, and help her do that. Ensure that she goes with the understanding that she may not get the job and that attending more interviews is important for when she goes for the one she wants.
By the way, there will hardly be jobs for CFA in Pune.
Regards
From India, Mumbai
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The Importance of Developing Street-Smart Children
Many parents make a mistake—they breed racehorses, not street-smart children. I am sorry to say this, but your daughter is a typical example of this. As many learned professional colleagues have pointed out, a smart child is someone who has developed interests in a lot of things apart from the curriculum: debating skills, oratory, teamwork, games, and activities. It is not sufficient to merely come out as the top ranker in academics; that is not just life—there is something beyond that. I know of many kids for whom books are their only companions, and they ultimately become bookworms. Books are essential not only to enhance and enrich their knowledge, but they end up as total failures when they face competition in this world.
Guidance for Developing Social Skills
There are a lot of training institutions and experienced HR professionals who can guide your daughter to become an extrovert. She should mix with both genders, talk to them, and interact with them. Give her a free hand in meeting people—I call this Controlled Freedom. Let her make career choices in which our interference should be minimal.
Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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Many parents make a mistake—they breed racehorses, not street-smart children. I am sorry to say this, but your daughter is a typical example of this. As many learned professional colleagues have pointed out, a smart child is someone who has developed interests in a lot of things apart from the curriculum: debating skills, oratory, teamwork, games, and activities. It is not sufficient to merely come out as the top ranker in academics; that is not just life—there is something beyond that. I know of many kids for whom books are their only companions, and they ultimately become bookworms. Books are essential not only to enhance and enrich their knowledge, but they end up as total failures when they face competition in this world.
Guidance for Developing Social Skills
There are a lot of training institutions and experienced HR professionals who can guide your daughter to become an extrovert. She should mix with both genders, talk to them, and interact with them. Give her a free hand in meeting people—I call this Controlled Freedom. Let her make career choices in which our interference should be minimal.
Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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I am not so sure about the conclusion regarding the introvertedness of Vijay's daughter. While this could be only one of the possibilities, I didn't want to make any assumptions. Hence, my very first query is asking about her extracurricular activities.
My interpretation, based on what Vijay mentioned, is just that it's a case of the father's and the daughter's views of the future not syncing.
Another way of looking at her not performing well in the interviews could be this: based purely on psychology, when someone doesn't have any interest in something, he/she tends to go through the motions of doing the task just to satisfy the other person(s). The more the person is forced to do what he/she doesn't like, the more the tendency to resist, in the way he/she deems possible. In the long run, this is bound to be dangerous for the poor kid, inculcating in him/her a sort of rebellious response mechanism even in normal situations.
I am sure everyone knows the tantrums of a one-year-old kid when he/she isn't given what he/she wants/likes. Except that in the case of adults, the response/reaction is camouflaged in more sophistication.
Vijay hasn't responded so far, so unless he responds clearly and openly, I guess we are only running around in circles giving suggestions based on 'premises and presumptions'.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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My interpretation, based on what Vijay mentioned, is just that it's a case of the father's and the daughter's views of the future not syncing.
Another way of looking at her not performing well in the interviews could be this: based purely on psychology, when someone doesn't have any interest in something, he/she tends to go through the motions of doing the task just to satisfy the other person(s). The more the person is forced to do what he/she doesn't like, the more the tendency to resist, in the way he/she deems possible. In the long run, this is bound to be dangerous for the poor kid, inculcating in him/her a sort of rebellious response mechanism even in normal situations.
I am sure everyone knows the tantrums of a one-year-old kid when he/she isn't given what he/she wants/likes. Except that in the case of adults, the response/reaction is camouflaged in more sophistication.
Vijay hasn't responded so far, so unless he responds clearly and openly, I guess we are only running around in circles giving suggestions based on 'premises and presumptions'.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Vijay, I wonder what you do for a living, as you have not responded to the suggestions made and questions raised, even two days after posting the query. Please do not get hurt by the comments made and questions raised about your approach and your daughter's achievement. Such questions arise and comments are made when people post messages that do not provide complete information about themselves and the scenario, leading to assumptions. My tutor had told me not to "ASS U ME"; that's how he spelled the word assume. He meant that when our assumptions are wrong, it makes "an ASS out of you and me."
Like Aussiejohn has said, I know students who have gone for 50+ interviews without success.
From United Kingdom
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Like Aussiejohn has said, I know students who have gone for 50+ interviews without success.
From United Kingdom
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Very true Nathrao, But in the meanwhile we all have a good time sharing our views, learning from one another and have another thread of good academic value :-)
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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Thank you all for the suggestions and your views on my daughter's case. I was unable to open the link to your reply, so I was delayed in responding. Everyone has provided valuable suggestions, and there is a lot to learn from every post. I accept that, although she excels in academics, she is not very social. Some members concluded that as typical parents, we forced our terms on her, which is not true.
My father gave me the freedom to choose my career, and I have also given my daughter the same freedom. Surprisingly, while studying in Dubai, she decided on pursuing CA after passing her 9th exam and even chose the college she would enroll in Pune. Throughout her articleship at a particular firm until she passed her CA, everything went according to her wishes. As parents, we never imposed our terms on her.
Regarding the interview, we tried to discuss with her to understand where things went wrong. I am aware of one instance where she went through all the steps and was selected, but when they asked her to work the afternoon to night shift (12 PM to 8 PM), she said she would think about it. Subsequently, when we asked her, she seemed irritated, which I have observed in many teenagers.
Due to her limited exposure to the outside world and lack of interaction with different people, she is somewhat hesitant to open up. However, it is not that we are conservative, but she herself does not want to socialize.
Thank you once again for all your valuable comments. I will also reflect on whether I am unintentionally doing anything wrong.
Regards to all,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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My father gave me the freedom to choose my career, and I have also given my daughter the same freedom. Surprisingly, while studying in Dubai, she decided on pursuing CA after passing her 9th exam and even chose the college she would enroll in Pune. Throughout her articleship at a particular firm until she passed her CA, everything went according to her wishes. As parents, we never imposed our terms on her.
Regarding the interview, we tried to discuss with her to understand where things went wrong. I am aware of one instance where she went through all the steps and was selected, but when they asked her to work the afternoon to night shift (12 PM to 8 PM), she said she would think about it. Subsequently, when we asked her, she seemed irritated, which I have observed in many teenagers.
Due to her limited exposure to the outside world and lack of interaction with different people, she is somewhat hesitant to open up. However, it is not that we are conservative, but she herself does not want to socialize.
Thank you once again for all your valuable comments. I will also reflect on whether I am unintentionally doing anything wrong.
Regards to all,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Encouragement and Guidance for Your Daughter
All that you have done here is commendable. Your concern for your daughter is truly appreciable. However, try to encourage your daughter to stand on her own. Just as every bird flies on its own, let her come up with insightful questions as to why she may have faced difficulties despite her academic achievements. Encourage her to approach her teachers or mentors as they might identify where she needs to improve and provide guidance. Be wary of excessive praise, as it can sometimes be a tactic to undermine her confidence.
Preparing for Interviews
When it comes to preparing for interviews, emphasize the importance of persistence, attitude, presence of mind, good communication skills, and confidence. It's also crucial for her to research the company she is interviewing with, understanding their products, services, market presence, and brand value beforehand to excel in the interview.
Instead of questioning why she didn't succeed in an interview, help her understand that her potential goes beyond any single opportunity. Have her sit down with a notebook and write a detailed account of the interview, focusing on areas where she could improve her responses. This self-analysis will not only enhance her communication skills but also boost her confidence.
Learning from Interview Experiences
Interview situations can be deceiving, as sometimes the interviewers may not be as skilled or knowledgeable as assumed. These experiences can be frustrating but teach valuable lessons in patience and adaptability. Encourage your daughter to learn from these encounters and maintain open communication with her.
Finding the Best Coaching for Soft Skills
Regarding your concerns about finding the best coaching for soft skills, there are numerous professionals available who can provide guidance and counseling to enhance your daughter's prospects. Reach out to local teachers for recommendations or explore reputable online training options. Soft skills are increasingly important in today's world, and short-term skill development courses can also be beneficial.
Best of luck, and remember to be compassionate in your approach towards guiding your daughter through these challenges.
Best regards.
From India, Arcot
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All that you have done here is commendable. Your concern for your daughter is truly appreciable. However, try to encourage your daughter to stand on her own. Just as every bird flies on its own, let her come up with insightful questions as to why she may have faced difficulties despite her academic achievements. Encourage her to approach her teachers or mentors as they might identify where she needs to improve and provide guidance. Be wary of excessive praise, as it can sometimes be a tactic to undermine her confidence.
Preparing for Interviews
When it comes to preparing for interviews, emphasize the importance of persistence, attitude, presence of mind, good communication skills, and confidence. It's also crucial for her to research the company she is interviewing with, understanding their products, services, market presence, and brand value beforehand to excel in the interview.
Instead of questioning why she didn't succeed in an interview, help her understand that her potential goes beyond any single opportunity. Have her sit down with a notebook and write a detailed account of the interview, focusing on areas where she could improve her responses. This self-analysis will not only enhance her communication skills but also boost her confidence.
Learning from Interview Experiences
Interview situations can be deceiving, as sometimes the interviewers may not be as skilled or knowledgeable as assumed. These experiences can be frustrating but teach valuable lessons in patience and adaptability. Encourage your daughter to learn from these encounters and maintain open communication with her.
Finding the Best Coaching for Soft Skills
Regarding your concerns about finding the best coaching for soft skills, there are numerous professionals available who can provide guidance and counseling to enhance your daughter's prospects. Reach out to local teachers for recommendations or explore reputable online training options. Soft skills are increasingly important in today's world, and short-term skill development courses can also be beneficial.
Best of luck, and remember to be compassionate in your approach towards guiding your daughter through these challenges.
Best regards.
From India, Arcot
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I agree with Mr. Diwakar's views about our current education system. As individuals, we can't change the system but need to go along with it. For sure, she needs counseling, and that's the reason I requested you to suggest a good counselor from Pune or Mumbai. I have even told her several times to be open and to tell me if I am mistaken or if there is anything she wants to speak about, but she does not open up at all. If I speak 100 lines (not in harsh language or screaming), she will answer either yes or no maybe once or twice, and that's all. It is possible she has gone into depression.
Socializing and Preferences
To answer Mr. Tajsateesh, as already mentioned, she is not much into socializing, but she has a good friend circle. Her first preference is always study. She hardly engages in any extracurricular activities. I have tried to speak with her several times, but she does not open up at all. It is possible that as an engineer, my expressions are different from her thinking, who is from finance. I convinced her to attend the interviews, and that's all. I am not forcing her to be on the job.
Interview Preparedness
To answer Mr. Natharao, I observed that she is always well-prepared before an interview. I even cross-checked with her out of curiosity and found she had all the details of the company before attending the interview. The only problem may be that she lacks confidence and decision-making ability.
Articleship Experience
To answer Nashbramhall, she has not approached the firm where she had done her articleship. When asked why not join the same firm, she told me that she was given only specific types of companies for auditing and not the MNCs, so the experience she got, like with charitable trusts, hospitals, etc., is not accepted by MNC people.
Freedom and Restrictions
To answer Mr. Sundaram, we never put any conditions or restrictions on her. We have given her the freedom to choose her friends irrespective of gender.
Unfortunately, I was not able to reply to you all because of a link problem. Thanks a lot again.
Regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Socializing and Preferences
To answer Mr. Tajsateesh, as already mentioned, she is not much into socializing, but she has a good friend circle. Her first preference is always study. She hardly engages in any extracurricular activities. I have tried to speak with her several times, but she does not open up at all. It is possible that as an engineer, my expressions are different from her thinking, who is from finance. I convinced her to attend the interviews, and that's all. I am not forcing her to be on the job.
Interview Preparedness
To answer Mr. Natharao, I observed that she is always well-prepared before an interview. I even cross-checked with her out of curiosity and found she had all the details of the company before attending the interview. The only problem may be that she lacks confidence and decision-making ability.
Articleship Experience
To answer Nashbramhall, she has not approached the firm where she had done her articleship. When asked why not join the same firm, she told me that she was given only specific types of companies for auditing and not the MNCs, so the experience she got, like with charitable trusts, hospitals, etc., is not accepted by MNC people.
Freedom and Restrictions
To answer Mr. Sundaram, we never put any conditions or restrictions on her. We have given her the freedom to choose her friends irrespective of gender.
Unfortunately, I was not able to reply to you all because of a link problem. Thanks a lot again.
Regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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With regard to your line "Secondly, some of the members concluded that as typical parents we forced our terms on her, which is not true," I don't think anyone 'concluded' on this aspect. Some, including myself, only 'presumed' in the absence of clarity or response from you. However, I am glad that this is not one of the possibilities for the current situation.
Exploring Career Interests
Coming to the actual solution to the situation you are facing, have you checked whether her true interest lies in academics? Some individuals wish to settle in the teaching line, and attending job interviews usually serves as a backup plan they build up.
Also, I suggest gently ascertaining her reasons for opting for CFA. There are never any 'right' or 'wrong' reasons for career choices. Every choice has its own set of pros and cons.
For example, the interview she attended... from her perspective, the odd shift from afternoon 12 to night 8 could be a con—although I don't think so, since in today's world, there's no guarantee that one can return by 5.00 PM if one seeks corporate jobs. Late sittings are the norm now. But it's she who will have to work, not me, you, or anyone else.
Or is it that something else happened in the interview that she's not sharing? Just a thought.
Keeping in Touch
Generally, it's wise to keep in touch with your kids' friends.
As long as the individual knows what he/she is getting into, any career choice is okay, presuming that it's not into something illegal. The idea is to ensure any decision is a well-informed decision—that's all. There's a plethora of career choices that we may think are crazy, but the individual concerned finds such elation in that field. I recall a recent case of an Indian mountain climber [the only one who climbed all the highest peaks in all the continents]—Babu, I think—who was found dead after 2-3 weeks in a mountain range in South America. I was surprised to read that he studied in IIT and also in IIM. What he found satisfaction in had nothing to do with what he studied.
If you have seen the CFA link that I mentioned in my earlier post, it should be clear that it takes anywhere from 2-3 years to become a full-fledged CFA. She should be ready for it, including planning out how she wants to handle her free time (there's no college here to attend and have regular timelines—she has to do a lot of self-planning of her time).
All the best.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Exploring Career Interests
Coming to the actual solution to the situation you are facing, have you checked whether her true interest lies in academics? Some individuals wish to settle in the teaching line, and attending job interviews usually serves as a backup plan they build up.
Also, I suggest gently ascertaining her reasons for opting for CFA. There are never any 'right' or 'wrong' reasons for career choices. Every choice has its own set of pros and cons.
For example, the interview she attended... from her perspective, the odd shift from afternoon 12 to night 8 could be a con—although I don't think so, since in today's world, there's no guarantee that one can return by 5.00 PM if one seeks corporate jobs. Late sittings are the norm now. But it's she who will have to work, not me, you, or anyone else.
Or is it that something else happened in the interview that she's not sharing? Just a thought.
Keeping in Touch
Generally, it's wise to keep in touch with your kids' friends.
As long as the individual knows what he/she is getting into, any career choice is okay, presuming that it's not into something illegal. The idea is to ensure any decision is a well-informed decision—that's all. There's a plethora of career choices that we may think are crazy, but the individual concerned finds such elation in that field. I recall a recent case of an Indian mountain climber [the only one who climbed all the highest peaks in all the continents]—Babu, I think—who was found dead after 2-3 weeks in a mountain range in South America. I was surprised to read that he studied in IIT and also in IIM. What he found satisfaction in had nothing to do with what he studied.
If you have seen the CFA link that I mentioned in my earlier post, it should be clear that it takes anywhere from 2-3 years to become a full-fledged CFA. She should be ready for it, including planning out how she wants to handle her free time (there's no college here to attend and have regular timelines—she has to do a lot of self-planning of her time).
All the best.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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I second Simhan. That will convey Vijay's concern for her as well as give her a chance to analyze for herself the various options she has. She's, after all, an adult now and should be able to make decisions herself to a large extent. And I don't think anything mentioned by the members or Vijay in this thread has any content that should be the cause of worry or apprehension for her... it's all well-meant and keeping her interest in mind.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Vijay,
I don't see it as her weakness in techniques; it is more about her being introverted and not able to mingle with people. Please have her go through a public speaking course, which would be a couple of weeks long. She needs to feel confident from within; the rest will fall into place.
From India, Hyderabad
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I don't see it as her weakness in techniques; it is more about her being introverted and not able to mingle with people. Please have her go through a public speaking course, which would be a couple of weeks long. She needs to feel confident from within; the rest will fall into place.
From India, Hyderabad
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It is not correct to say that the communication is one-sided and that I do not have the courtesy to reply to the postings. I have already tried to respond to almost everyone's suggestions. Of course, it is not possible to reply to every member as we do in "WhatsApp." I thank everyone who provided valuable information. I posted two replies with sufficient explanation and context, so it is not fair to accuse anyone of lacking the courtesy to reply to members.
Instead of replying to every post individually, I prefer to wait for 3-4 postings and reply to them all in one post, which I am doing. There are always two sides to a coin. Secondly, I am a hardcore technical person who is not very familiar with HR terms, so some of the postings are really tough for me to understand.
Mr. Raghunathan, my daughter has already contacted Mr. Jacob, and both of them are in communication with each other. She has also agreed to look for some personality development classes.
Regards to all.
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Instead of replying to every post individually, I prefer to wait for 3-4 postings and reply to them all in one post, which I am doing. There are always two sides to a coin. Secondly, I am a hardcore technical person who is not very familiar with HR terms, so some of the postings are really tough for me to understand.
Mr. Raghunathan, my daughter has already contacted Mr. Jacob, and both of them are in communication with each other. She has also agreed to look for some personality development classes.
Regards to all.
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Understanding the Challenges of Job Hunting for Young Professionals
As Mr. Tajsateesh has correctly pointed out, my comments were general and not specifically about you, Mr. Vijay. As a parent, I fully understand the mental agony and turmoil you must be experiencing. A girl not securing a job that matches her qualifications in today's competitive world is akin to her not getting married despite reaching the appropriate age. The concern is genuine. What we expected was a simple acknowledgment of having received the inputs (perhaps more than you anticipated!). As they say, giving advice to others is the easiest thing in the world. However, in a forum like this, filled with professionals, the advice given is based more on their knowledge, skills, and experience gained over the years. We do not offer off-the-cuff advice, like a remedy for a 'cold'!
I am happy that your daughter is on the right track, and we wish her all success. These days, I understand that CA branches in various major cities conduct numerous soft skill training programs, such as presentation skills (my son is a CA, and I know this for certain!), to further enhance the soft skills of CAs. You can explore this as well.
Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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As Mr. Tajsateesh has correctly pointed out, my comments were general and not specifically about you, Mr. Vijay. As a parent, I fully understand the mental agony and turmoil you must be experiencing. A girl not securing a job that matches her qualifications in today's competitive world is akin to her not getting married despite reaching the appropriate age. The concern is genuine. What we expected was a simple acknowledgment of having received the inputs (perhaps more than you anticipated!). As they say, giving advice to others is the easiest thing in the world. However, in a forum like this, filled with professionals, the advice given is based more on their knowledge, skills, and experience gained over the years. We do not offer off-the-cuff advice, like a remedy for a 'cold'!
I am happy that your daughter is on the right track, and we wish her all success. These days, I understand that CA branches in various major cities conduct numerous soft skill training programs, such as presentation skills (my son is a CA, and I know this for certain!), to further enhance the soft skills of CAs. You can explore this as well.
Best wishes
From India, Bengaluru
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I missed out on reading this line you mentioned earlier: "I frankly admit learning more by being in the position of 'giver' and also from other learned members."
This doesn't just apply to you alone; it's very natural that givers ALWAYS learn/gain MORE than takers for the simple reason that any giver normally tries to evaluate and analyze what others have suggested and how his/her ideas/gyan are different from others. So, in the process, it's but natural that he/she gains/learns a lot more than he/she is giving.
While any taker's tendency is to look JUST for the solution to his/her problem in what's being offered by others, usually IGNORING all other points/ideas (that he/she THINKS are irrelevant to his/her current issue/problem)—in short, their focus is very narrow and short-term. While there's nothing wrong per se in this, such people lose out on the larger picture of any issue/situation.
And quite often, this comes out very clearly from his/her postings that lack in clarity, etc.
This is differentiated from those who are currently takers but have the potential to become givers along the way...
The best current example I can think of is Vijay, who has realized that the initial inputs he provided were leading to many presumptions that were either untrue or only partially true, and has cared to give more detailed inputs. I am sure he has learned much more NOW than when he initiated this thread, when the objective would have been to just get a solution to his daughter's problem.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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This doesn't just apply to you alone; it's very natural that givers ALWAYS learn/gain MORE than takers for the simple reason that any giver normally tries to evaluate and analyze what others have suggested and how his/her ideas/gyan are different from others. So, in the process, it's but natural that he/she gains/learns a lot more than he/she is giving.
While any taker's tendency is to look JUST for the solution to his/her problem in what's being offered by others, usually IGNORING all other points/ideas (that he/she THINKS are irrelevant to his/her current issue/problem)—in short, their focus is very narrow and short-term. While there's nothing wrong per se in this, such people lose out on the larger picture of any issue/situation.
And quite often, this comes out very clearly from his/her postings that lack in clarity, etc.
This is differentiated from those who are currently takers but have the potential to become givers along the way...
The best current example I can think of is Vijay, who has realized that the initial inputs he provided were leading to many presumptions that were either untrue or only partially true, and has cared to give more detailed inputs. I am sure he has learned much more NOW than when he initiated this thread, when the objective would have been to just get a solution to his daughter's problem.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Your daughter tried to get into IIM, but unfortunately, she couldn't make it on the first attempt. As you know, it is really difficult to get into IIMs since the quality and reputation of IIM education matter utmost among the corporate world. Many candidates succeed after more than one attempt in CAT. The entrance exams consist of a written test, group discussion, personal interviews, etc. Before attending the CAT, a candidate should understand the extreme competition involved in this examination.
Now, your daughter is a CA by profession. Becoming a CA is also really difficult since it deals with a lot of subjects in detail. Becoming a CA on the first attempt is really prestigious. If a candidate can do so, it obviously means he or she is highly intellectual. So there is no point in worrying about it. The only problem is a lack of soft skills.
If she is really interested in having a corporate career in the finance domain, she needs more knowledge in the concerned subject than soft skills. Luckily, your daughter has it, and she has proved it to everyone. Now it can be nurtured with the help of soft skill trainers who are available in almost all metros in India. The knowledge one possesses, which needs to be presented and implemented in the corporate world when required, depends on the confidence level of the professional taking up the concerned role. That means no matter how knowledgeable we are, it becomes absolutely useless if we are not competent enough to use it as and when required owing to a lack of confidence.
Your daughter attended some interviews but was unable to make it, and now not even ready to attend any more interviews, showing she may be lacking soft skill training and confidence that made her desperate to make a career in the corporate world.
She can have many options.
She can become perfectly employable in terms of both knowledge and soft skills competency. A set of confidence-building measures is part of the program that may be available with soft skills training/counseling institutes nearby your home.
Or she can be an independent financial consultant by practicing under a senior CA for some time and start a consultancy of her own, which does not require that much degree of soft skills needed for a corporate career. However, in my opinion, it is better to have some soft skill training for your daughter. It will obviously help her to deal with a bold mind in complicated situations in the future, whether as a consultant or as a corporate professional.
Discuss the matter with your daughter in detail. Let her decide her course of action.
Thank you
From India, Thiruvananthapuram
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Now, your daughter is a CA by profession. Becoming a CA is also really difficult since it deals with a lot of subjects in detail. Becoming a CA on the first attempt is really prestigious. If a candidate can do so, it obviously means he or she is highly intellectual. So there is no point in worrying about it. The only problem is a lack of soft skills.
If she is really interested in having a corporate career in the finance domain, she needs more knowledge in the concerned subject than soft skills. Luckily, your daughter has it, and she has proved it to everyone. Now it can be nurtured with the help of soft skill trainers who are available in almost all metros in India. The knowledge one possesses, which needs to be presented and implemented in the corporate world when required, depends on the confidence level of the professional taking up the concerned role. That means no matter how knowledgeable we are, it becomes absolutely useless if we are not competent enough to use it as and when required owing to a lack of confidence.
Your daughter attended some interviews but was unable to make it, and now not even ready to attend any more interviews, showing she may be lacking soft skill training and confidence that made her desperate to make a career in the corporate world.
She can have many options.
She can become perfectly employable in terms of both knowledge and soft skills competency. A set of confidence-building measures is part of the program that may be available with soft skills training/counseling institutes nearby your home.
Or she can be an independent financial consultant by practicing under a senior CA for some time and start a consultancy of her own, which does not require that much degree of soft skills needed for a corporate career. However, in my opinion, it is better to have some soft skill training for your daughter. It will obviously help her to deal with a bold mind in complicated situations in the future, whether as a consultant or as a corporate professional.
Discuss the matter with your daughter in detail. Let her decide her course of action.
Thank you
From India, Thiruvananthapuram
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Thank you very much for your reply and valuable suggestions. I was really touched by the response I received from all the members and have to admit that I should have asked for your help long before. Things have changed a lot now. She is looking forward to many things and both my wife and I can see lots of changes in her. As mentioned earlier, she has started looking into soft skill and personality development programs. Regarding your suggestion about working for some time with a CA firm and then starting our own practice, that was my first suggestion to her which she refused. I tried to explain to her from various angles, but she was not able to accept. Still, I am optimistic that she will understand the benefits of having our own firm, but on the other hand, I don't want to force my terms on her.
With this message, I would like to thank all the members who took out their precious time to post their suggestions.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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With this message, I would like to thank all the members who took out their precious time to post their suggestions.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Dear Mr. Vijay,
Let me congratulate you on her topping.
1. She should understand that when she can easily clear the difficult papers, interviews are nothing for her.
2. Failure is the greatest success to gain experience.
3. Getting a job in a single attempt is not a great achievement, but with learned experience, it is a really great feeling and confidence we will have.
4. She should practice facing herself in the mirror, speak confidently, and have some mock interviews at home.
5. One positive thought can change the entire scenario.
6. Try and try until we achieve success rather than giving up in between.
7. She is in a stage of confusion about pursuing CA, MBA, and CFA. What is her final goal to achieve? She should try to understand her confusion.
Regards,
NVN
From India , Hyderabad
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Let me congratulate you on her topping.
1. She should understand that when she can easily clear the difficult papers, interviews are nothing for her.
2. Failure is the greatest success to gain experience.
3. Getting a job in a single attempt is not a great achievement, but with learned experience, it is a really great feeling and confidence we will have.
4. She should practice facing herself in the mirror, speak confidently, and have some mock interviews at home.
5. One positive thought can change the entire scenario.
6. Try and try until we achieve success rather than giving up in between.
7. She is in a stage of confusion about pursuing CA, MBA, and CFA. What is her final goal to achieve? She should try to understand her confusion.
Regards,
NVN
From India , Hyderabad
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Thank you for your reply. As mentioned in my earlier post, she will be joining the personality development-soft skill program very shortly. From my observation, she is not accustomed to facing defeat, so a series of failures might have depressed her. After the first failure, she might be reflecting on her previous interview, which could have caused a problem for her.
She appears more positive now, which may be the result of the suggestions offered by our members. Your post will also be beneficial for her to consider the points you raised. Regarding CA, MBA, or CFA, we had a similar debate in the past, but I withdrew as I am a technical person. Surely, she must have a better understanding than me about the future prospects in finance studies. Additionally, at certain stages, she was influenced by her friends, leading her to make some incorrect decisions.
Thank you once again.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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She appears more positive now, which may be the result of the suggestions offered by our members. Your post will also be beneficial for her to consider the points you raised. Regarding CA, MBA, or CFA, we had a similar debate in the past, but I withdrew as I am a technical person. Surely, she must have a better understanding than me about the future prospects in finance studies. Additionally, at certain stages, she was influenced by her friends, leading her to make some incorrect decisions.
Thank you once again.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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Interview Techniques.ppt
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