Dear Senior,
I would like to seek your expert advice.
Presently, I am working with a Media/Event organization. We are generally following flexi hours, i.e., between 8:30 to 10:45 am, an employee can punch the card, complete 9 hrs of shift, and can leave. If, in case, any employee punches the card, e.g., at 10:55 am, they will be marked as having taken short leave for that particular day. However, if an employee gives more than 9 hrs but still has their leave/salary deducted, it can be quite demotivating for them. Even after working for 10 or 12 hrs of a shift, just because they arrive 10 or 15 minutes late, they face deductions. Please advise on what we can suggest to amend this rule.
I would like to clarify that late coming initially gets adjusted from the employee's leave balance. Once leaves are exhausted, then the salary gets cut. However, employees in both cases are not satisfied just because they are putting in more than 9 hrs.
In my opinion, I would suggest that we make an amendment to the rule such that any employee who is in the office for over 50 hours in any week (instead of the minimum required 45 hours) will be entitled to adjust the time beyond 50 hours up to a maximum of one hour in that week against any late coming (or against leaving early - as the case may be).
I am seeking your suggestions as well.
Please advise.
Manisha Singh
From India, Delhi
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4I would like to seek your expert advice.
Presently, I am working with a Media/Event organization. We are generally following flexi hours, i.e., between 8:30 to 10:45 am, an employee can punch the card, complete 9 hrs of shift, and can leave. If, in case, any employee punches the card, e.g., at 10:55 am, they will be marked as having taken short leave for that particular day. However, if an employee gives more than 9 hrs but still has their leave/salary deducted, it can be quite demotivating for them. Even after working for 10 or 12 hrs of a shift, just because they arrive 10 or 15 minutes late, they face deductions. Please advise on what we can suggest to amend this rule.
I would like to clarify that late coming initially gets adjusted from the employee's leave balance. Once leaves are exhausted, then the salary gets cut. However, employees in both cases are not satisfied just because they are putting in more than 9 hrs.
In my opinion, I would suggest that we make an amendment to the rule such that any employee who is in the office for over 50 hours in any week (instead of the minimum required 45 hours) will be entitled to adjust the time beyond 50 hours up to a maximum of one hour in that week against any late coming (or against leaving early - as the case may be).
I am seeking your suggestions as well.
Please advise.
Manisha Singh
From India, Delhi
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Dear Senior,
I would like to seek your expert advice.
Presently, I am working with a Media/Event organization. We are generally following flexible hours, i.e., between 8:30 to 10:45 am, an employee can clock in and complete a 9-hour shift before leaving. However, if an employee clocks in after 10:45 am, they will be marked as taking a short leave for that day. Even if the employee works more than 9 hours, their leave/salary gets deducted. This practice is quite demotivating for them. Despite working for 10 or 12 hours, just because they are 10 or 15 minutes late, they face deductions.
Please advise on what amendments we can suggest to improve this rule. Late arrivals are currently adjusted from the employee's leave balance. Once their leaves are exhausted, salary deductions are made. However, employees are dissatisfied in both scenarios as they are putting in more than the required 9 hours.
In my opinion, I propose amending the rule to state that any employee present in the office for over 50 hours in a week (instead of the minimum required 45 hours) should be allowed to adjust the time beyond 50 hours, up to a maximum of one hour in that week, to offset any late arrivals or early departures.
I look forward to your suggestions. Please advise.
Regards,
Manisha Singh
From India, Bangalore
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I would like to seek your expert advice.
Presently, I am working with a Media/Event organization. We are generally following flexible hours, i.e., between 8:30 to 10:45 am, an employee can clock in and complete a 9-hour shift before leaving. However, if an employee clocks in after 10:45 am, they will be marked as taking a short leave for that day. Even if the employee works more than 9 hours, their leave/salary gets deducted. This practice is quite demotivating for them. Despite working for 10 or 12 hours, just because they are 10 or 15 minutes late, they face deductions.
Please advise on what amendments we can suggest to improve this rule. Late arrivals are currently adjusted from the employee's leave balance. Once their leaves are exhausted, salary deductions are made. However, employees are dissatisfied in both scenarios as they are putting in more than the required 9 hours.
In my opinion, I propose amending the rule to state that any employee present in the office for over 50 hours in a week (instead of the minimum required 45 hours) should be allowed to adjust the time beyond 50 hours, up to a maximum of one hour in that week, to offset any late arrivals or early departures.
I look forward to your suggestions. Please advise.
Regards,
Manisha Singh
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Manisha,
Greetings of the day!
You can change the shift times in your software or punching machine as per the hourly rate, then it will calculate only hours rather than incoming and outgoing time.
Thanks & Regards,
Ajay
From India, Mumbai
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Greetings of the day!
You can change the shift times in your software or punching machine as per the hourly rate, then it will calculate only hours rather than incoming and outgoing time.
Thanks & Regards,
Ajay
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Manisha,
There are two sides to this. On one side, as you mentioned, the employees get demotivated if penalized for coming in even 10 minutes late. But on the other side, you have to consider the fact that some checks and measures have to be in place to ensure discipline and commitment. You are already enjoying the benefits of flexi-hours which, believe me, a lot of people from other companies would give an arm and a leg to have in their organizations! And you have a window of 2 hours and 15 minutes. Surely, a well-meaning employee should be able to adjust within that window. If there is a genuine reason (and that will not happen very often, only about 2-3 times a month), then to accommodate for that, I support the suggestion given by Rajeev Dixit.
Also, the fact that they are working for more than 9 hours is not a good reason to walk in any time they want. Scientifically too, the first few hours are your most productive, and the company will not want to lose out on that. If somebody is staying late to finish work constantly, or if almost everybody is doing that, you may want to look at other factors to correct that.
Regards,
Manish Majumdar.
From India, Jodhpur
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There are two sides to this. On one side, as you mentioned, the employees get demotivated if penalized for coming in even 10 minutes late. But on the other side, you have to consider the fact that some checks and measures have to be in place to ensure discipline and commitment. You are already enjoying the benefits of flexi-hours which, believe me, a lot of people from other companies would give an arm and a leg to have in their organizations! And you have a window of 2 hours and 15 minutes. Surely, a well-meaning employee should be able to adjust within that window. If there is a genuine reason (and that will not happen very often, only about 2-3 times a month), then to accommodate for that, I support the suggestion given by Rajeev Dixit.
Also, the fact that they are working for more than 9 hours is not a good reason to walk in any time they want. Scientifically too, the first few hours are your most productive, and the company will not want to lose out on that. If somebody is staying late to finish work constantly, or if almost everybody is doing that, you may want to look at other factors to correct that.
Regards,
Manish Majumdar.
From India, Jodhpur
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Dear Manisha,
Flexi-timings itself is a good thing that your company has implemented (much needed in metros because of traffic). Regarding your concerns about latecoming, you can introduce a Late Coming form. An employee arriving late after a stipulated time period must fill out a late coming form. The form should be submitted by the concerned employee to the HR department after approval from their HOD/Section Head. This process will also help you understand the primary reason for latecoming, whether intentional or due to other reasons.
Regards,
Gurpreet Singh
From India, Anjar
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Flexi-timings itself is a good thing that your company has implemented (much needed in metros because of traffic). Regarding your concerns about latecoming, you can introduce a Late Coming form. An employee arriving late after a stipulated time period must fill out a late coming form. The form should be submitted by the concerned employee to the HR department after approval from their HOD/Section Head. This process will also help you understand the primary reason for latecoming, whether intentional or due to other reasons.
Regards,
Gurpreet Singh
From India, Anjar
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Dear Manisha,
Greetings.
It's a good practice to follow flexible hours, but it should be done in a disciplined manner. You can suggest a half-day salary deduction for any three or four days in a month where an employee is late by more than 15 minutes after 10:45 a.m., i.e., up to 11 a.m. For any delays beyond 11 a.m., a half-day deduction can be applied for that particular day.
From India, Kota
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Greetings.
It's a good practice to follow flexible hours, but it should be done in a disciplined manner. You can suggest a half-day salary deduction for any three or four days in a month where an employee is late by more than 15 minutes after 10:45 a.m., i.e., up to 11 a.m. For any delays beyond 11 a.m., a half-day deduction can be applied for that particular day.
From India, Kota
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Discipline is discipline!! No compromise. Office timings must be fixed, and one can get the benefit of 10-15 minutes grace only; otherwise, your office will become a "Fish Market" where people will come and go with no control.
In the case of your office, if you are giving them flexible hours to punch in and start the day, then what kind of motivation are they looking for? When it comes to motivation, there are numerous ways to motivate staff. It is now in your hands to maintain discipline or create a chaotic environment that requires motivation in that way.
We are Indians, and if our employer provides us with an Audi, a driver, a sea-facing flat, a seven-digit monthly salary, and numerous facilities, only then will we say, "Yaar kahi achi job lag jae to maza ah jae." Chill HR!
From India, Gurgaon
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In the case of your office, if you are giving them flexible hours to punch in and start the day, then what kind of motivation are they looking for? When it comes to motivation, there are numerous ways to motivate staff. It is now in your hands to maintain discipline or create a chaotic environment that requires motivation in that way.
We are Indians, and if our employer provides us with an Audi, a driver, a sea-facing flat, a seven-digit monthly salary, and numerous facilities, only then will we say, "Yaar kahi achi job lag jae to maza ah jae." Chill HR!
From India, Gurgaon
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You need to be very careful while making such decisions of penalizing. The best way is to identify chronic misusers by monitoring attendance trends. Speak to people to understand the job role. If there is a genuine need where an employee is facing some personal issue but at the same time completing his assignments and coming near to stipulated work hours, favor must be given.
We were facing a similar issue. We sensitized people through regular communications, publishing reports, and counseling. Today, we don't have anyone who is misusing flexi timings; most of the people don't do such things intentionally.
From India, Mumbai
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We were facing a similar issue. We sensitized people through regular communications, publishing reports, and counseling. Today, we don't have anyone who is misusing flexi timings; most of the people don't do such things intentionally.
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Mr. Chill HR,
Are you from India or what? This kind of mentality is not something we possess. We work hard, and only when we are dissatisfied with the services or if we do not receive anything in return, does this situation occur, but it is not the norm.
And yes, life requires changes. Today, I have a Hyundai, tomorrow I will want a BMW, and then a Jaguar, and so on. These are all luxuries for which we work. So, please...
Thank you.
From India, New Delhi
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Are you from India or what? This kind of mentality is not something we possess. We work hard, and only when we are dissatisfied with the services or if we do not receive anything in return, does this situation occur, but it is not the norm.
And yes, life requires changes. Today, I have a Hyundai, tomorrow I will want a BMW, and then a Jaguar, and so on. These are all luxuries for which we work. So, please...
Thank you.
From India, New Delhi
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Dear Manisha, Its better to consult with your time office software as I know there are two ways fixed timings and the flexi timings.They will guide you better.
From United States
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From United States
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Dear Manisha,
In addition to what Manish Majumdar has said, I would like to draw your attention towards interdepartmental coordination as well. Discipline is a must in an organization for smooth workflow. At times, if an employee is unavailable when required, work might suffer. Assuming yours is a process-driven organization and you have enough manpower to handle tasks, a company should never compromise on discipline.
A flexibility of 2 hours is a commendable practice. If you wish to extend this liberty further, you can consider two methods:
1. Allowing a maximum number of times an employee can arrive late, OR
2. Allowing late arrivals up to 45 minutes in total for a month and deducting half a day for every 15 minutes thereafter. For example, if an employee is late for 64 minutes:
- First 45 minutes - no deduction
- Next 15 minutes - half-day deduction
- Next 4 minutes - half-day deduction
Please understand that policies always have benefits and penalties attached to them. You cannot keep changing your policies every time after implementation based on employee feedback. HR should have a stable approach to empathize and bridge the gap between management and employees. Policies should never be one-sided.
The solution you have suggested does not highlight the potential benefits the organization may gain. Have you considered that aspect as well?
Thank you.
From India, Ahmedabad
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In addition to what Manish Majumdar has said, I would like to draw your attention towards interdepartmental coordination as well. Discipline is a must in an organization for smooth workflow. At times, if an employee is unavailable when required, work might suffer. Assuming yours is a process-driven organization and you have enough manpower to handle tasks, a company should never compromise on discipline.
A flexibility of 2 hours is a commendable practice. If you wish to extend this liberty further, you can consider two methods:
1. Allowing a maximum number of times an employee can arrive late, OR
2. Allowing late arrivals up to 45 minutes in total for a month and deducting half a day for every 15 minutes thereafter. For example, if an employee is late for 64 minutes:
- First 45 minutes - no deduction
- Next 15 minutes - half-day deduction
- Next 4 minutes - half-day deduction
Please understand that policies always have benefits and penalties attached to them. You cannot keep changing your policies every time after implementation based on employee feedback. HR should have a stable approach to empathize and bridge the gap between management and employees. Policies should never be one-sided.
The solution you have suggested does not highlight the potential benefits the organization may gain. Have you considered that aspect as well?
Thank you.
From India, Ahmedabad
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Hello Friends,
Discipline is discipline, and there should be no compromise with it!
According to me, based on my seven years of experience, whenever I am late, it is intentional from my side. One can receive grace for some instances with a valid explanation in writing approved by their HOD. So, as you have mentioned flexible timings, you have already provided comfort and relaxation with flexible shifts, so there is no need to stipulate a specific morning time. It is better not to change the policy. Just advise employees to adhere to it honestly, as it gives a good impression when employees are regular and disciplined.
Ved Parkash Bawa
AM (P & A)
From India, Delhi
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Discipline is discipline, and there should be no compromise with it!
According to me, based on my seven years of experience, whenever I am late, it is intentional from my side. One can receive grace for some instances with a valid explanation in writing approved by their HOD. So, as you have mentioned flexible timings, you have already provided comfort and relaxation with flexible shifts, so there is no need to stipulate a specific morning time. It is better not to change the policy. Just advise employees to adhere to it honestly, as it gives a good impression when employees are regular and disciplined.
Ved Parkash Bawa
AM (P & A)
From India, Delhi
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Hey Parul.
Don't take it otherwise. It seems that you are one of those who want everything without discipline. And one suggestion for you, take suggestions of mine not to heart. If you stay disciplined, success will touch your feet. If not, please chill.
From India, Gurgaon
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Don't take it otherwise. It seems that you are one of those who want everything without discipline. And one suggestion for you, take suggestions of mine not to heart. If you stay disciplined, success will touch your feet. If not, please chill.
From India, Gurgaon
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Dear Manisha,
In my opinion, flexi-timings between 8:30 AM and 10:45 AM are quite lenient (2 hours and 15 minutes). I think that beyond this, if you still want to make it flexible, it will have no meaning regardless of the fact that they stay beyond the stipulated working hours. Employees need to be present in an organization during specified periods of time when business transactions take place. If you wish, you can have a core group of employees who must be present in the office at fixed periods of time. For the other employees, you can have time slots when they need to be present. In media/event organizations, to my knowledge, the times they leave vary, and they stay late in the evenings to complete their activities.
You will appreciate that employees may be required to answer client calls, hold meetings on a business prospect, schedule events in consultation with specialists in respective areas, etc. Hence, I feel that you need to have staggered but flexible timings (with time limits for reporting time) for categories of employees that suit the needs of the organization. The attendance system can be fine-tuned to meet such requirements.
M.V. Kannan
From India, Madras
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In my opinion, flexi-timings between 8:30 AM and 10:45 AM are quite lenient (2 hours and 15 minutes). I think that beyond this, if you still want to make it flexible, it will have no meaning regardless of the fact that they stay beyond the stipulated working hours. Employees need to be present in an organization during specified periods of time when business transactions take place. If you wish, you can have a core group of employees who must be present in the office at fixed periods of time. For the other employees, you can have time slots when they need to be present. In media/event organizations, to my knowledge, the times they leave vary, and they stay late in the evenings to complete their activities.
You will appreciate that employees may be required to answer client calls, hold meetings on a business prospect, schedule events in consultation with specialists in respective areas, etc. Hence, I feel that you need to have staggered but flexible timings (with time limits for reporting time) for categories of employees that suit the needs of the organization. The attendance system can be fine-tuned to meet such requirements.
M.V. Kannan
From India, Madras
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I agree with Gurgaon HR regarding discipline; there should not be any compromise. I also agree with Parul Tomer. Everybody has the right to grow and go for things that offer better prospects and good returns against their efforts.
Ms. Manisha, I appreciate your concern and the suggestion you gave on calculating the total office hours per week to 50 hours. However, we should also identify employees who are reporting late most frequently. Additionally, you need to identify job roles, productive time, and assignments.
Since you mentioned you work in an advertising company, you can allocate work in a project-based manner. For example, assign a project to an employee and provide them with a comfortable time frame to complete it, especially for technical staff. For accounts, admin, and other departments, you can implement a policy of 50 to 55 hours to accommodate any lateness or early departures.
One option is to introduce a shift system. Employees could select a shift after obtaining approval from their immediate HOD with proper adjustments.
Babudada
From India, Mumbai
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Ms. Manisha, I appreciate your concern and the suggestion you gave on calculating the total office hours per week to 50 hours. However, we should also identify employees who are reporting late most frequently. Additionally, you need to identify job roles, productive time, and assignments.
Since you mentioned you work in an advertising company, you can allocate work in a project-based manner. For example, assign a project to an employee and provide them with a comfortable time frame to complete it, especially for technical staff. For accounts, admin, and other departments, you can implement a policy of 50 to 55 hours to accommodate any lateness or early departures.
One option is to introduce a shift system. Employees could select a shift after obtaining approval from their immediate HOD with proper adjustments.
Babudada
From India, Mumbai
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Dear Manisha,
It’s good that you are having flexi timing of punching. There is no need of extending the timing of punching without carrying out investigations. First check the reason for the late coming then check that all the employees who are coming from that area are having this problem or very few. This will give you an idea that the person is knowingly doing it or it is a genuine problem which is affecting a group of people. Accordingly you can take action against them. If some time change is required then change your punching timing to 09:00 insted of 8:30 and on the other side to 11:15 from 10:45.
From India, Mumbai
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It’s good that you are having flexi timing of punching. There is no need of extending the timing of punching without carrying out investigations. First check the reason for the late coming then check that all the employees who are coming from that area are having this problem or very few. This will give you an idea that the person is knowingly doing it or it is a genuine problem which is affecting a group of people. Accordingly you can take action against them. If some time change is required then change your punching timing to 09:00 insted of 8:30 and on the other side to 11:15 from 10:45.
From India, Mumbai
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