Employees Are Talented But Indisciplined

Hi All,

I am working with a small software firm; I am alone in the HR department here. The employees who are working with this firm are talented and have served a good tenure here. However, they are undisciplined regarding working hours and leaves.

There are two groups: management and employees. The employees have created a college-like atmosphere, considering management as professors. Please suggest ways to help make my employees more professional.

Thanks

Did the management ask you to look into this and resolve? This culture must have been set by the owners with a goal in mind. We appreciate your effort to bring about a change, which seems to be legitimate and the need of the hour.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Rather interesting and it seems this is a case where the leadership style is probably the main cause of such a scenario. Although I would be careful of sudden changes as that may crumble the organization and productivity.

Had it been me, I would've strengthened the performance-based incentive structure and added an Employee of the Month award to move the system to a slightly more formal structure. You also need to realize that the reason why you have low attrition and talented folks still in the company is because of the relaxed ambiance. You just need to concentrate on driving these individuals toward professional excellence.

Regards,
Sid

Sid gave very practical suggestions to you on how to introduce some method into this madness. It appears that the prevailing culture in your office seems to have the sanction of senior leadership, who might have prioritized talent over a relaxed and flexible work culture. You may be embarking on a misadventure if you initiate knee-jerk actions like marking latecomers or issuing memos from the next day. First, make your senior leadership confident by discussing the issue, but not just by discussing the issue; propose solutions that bring about a change in the current culture slowly but surely. You can also introduce incentives like attendance bonuses and involve them more in the decision-making process so that a sense of responsibility gradually seeps in, leading to behavioral changes. You need to act as a change agent rather than a disciplinarian.

B. Saikumar
Mumbai

I agree with Ms. Nobomita and second her. This is purely how you perceive the current work culture in your company. I am sure your top management is aware of it. Unless it is within tolerable limits, I believe your management is favoring it. As an HR professional, you have limited roles and responsibilities to fulfill. Now, try to figure out to what extent this culture is hindering employee and organizational growth (including factors related to profitability). Focus on organizational growth factors because the majority of managements are keen to see their companies generate more profits.

As long as the work culture supports organizational growth factors, I suggest you ignore whatever issues you have come across. You should not be held responsible for fine-tuning the existing work culture unless you are empowered, held accountable, and responsible for establishing and maintaining a pre-defined disciplinary work culture in your organization. Let your employees enjoy their work life as students while management plays the role of a professor. Students will only realize the reality when these professors make changes in their behavior reflecting a different attitude from the current one.

With profound regards

(Cite Contribution) has raised valid questions, and other HR experts have given some useful ideas. Hence, this sort of problem is faced by CEOs of even large organizations. For example, see the news reports on Yahoo which appeared in Feb 2013. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/26/te...bXtHJ19jB4ADEg and 4 Reasons Marissa Mayer's No-At-Home-Work Policy Is an Epic Fail - Forbes.

So, my suggestion is to kindly tread with caution and not do anything without the backing of the bosses.

The first thing that pops into our mind when we hear the term corporate culture is a great many people refer to the classic phrase coined by the McKinsey organization, that culture is "how we do things around here." And while that may be true, there are so many elements that go into determining it.

Different scholars have classified culture differently. One such classification and its definition perhaps suits your type of culture...Baseball team Culture: A baseball team culture considers the employees as the most treasured possession of the organization. The employees are the true assets of the organization who have a major role in its successful functioning. In such a culture, the individuals always have an upper edge and they do not bother much about their organization. Advertising agencies, event management companies, financial institutions follow such a culture.

So there is no IDEAL culture; it has to be inculcated and nurtured to align with organizational effectiveness. In your case, you have to judge the thin line between Flexibility and Indiscipline and derive a strategy to induce Discipline in the given culture (if the existing culture delivers effectiveness to the organization.)

Good Luck

Shailesh Parikh

Vadodara, Gujarat

99 98 97 10 65

Good day, dear all,

I also belong to a similar situation - a small software company with kind of indisciplined staff, allowing a relaxed ambiance in fear of talented employees quitting, and silently developing a system's "cage" to "trap" them! I am not very experienced in the world of HR and am slowly learning. This portal is a prime resource for me. One thing I have become sure of is that such a situation can only be handled with patience and the personality of the HR. This is a very sensitive standpoint between the management and the employees.

Regards,
Subhabrata Seal

From the HR point of view, they may be perceived as indisciplined and lacking in culture, etc. These days, being informal in the IT industry is the norm. As our learned friends have pointed out above, you can't change anything without the blessings of the management. As long as productivity is maintained without any slip-ups and deadlines are met according to schedule, there is no need to worry.

If, on the other hand, the management is equally concerned about this college-like atmosphere and casual attitude towards work, you should take the initiative to present alternatives to management such as establishing systems and procedures, implementing disciplinary actions, and so on.

Therefore, you must make a decision on this matter before acting hastily!

In such a firm, laissez-faire leadership is important. You can prepare ways you could affect them indirectly. For such employees, group discussion and rehearsing the company's final GOAL and mission statements are very important. You can also support them in family affairs, such as marriage and how they could lead their life simply. The stability of their job satisfaction is the main important issue you have to consider.

Sincerely yours,

Daru Selam

As an HR professional, it is a good concern, but you have to look and frame policies as per the requirements.

If you look at the software industry, generally the project is time-bound, and hence ideally these teams usually have no specific working hours. Developers can do coding for hours if they find a friendly atmosphere. Hence, generally for the development team, there should be a flexible atmosphere, but one should ensure that they are putting in a minimum amount of hours daily as decided by the project manager or management. If you make them wear a tie and formal dresses, they might not be comfortable.

Usually, an awareness of good manners should always be conveyed from time to time. They should always be motivated.

On the other hand, if you look at the sales team or the management team who are generally exposed to clients in the outside world, yes, they should have a formal attire as this gives an image and impression about the company.

Dear Raginiti,

A lot of seniors have given their replies. However, let me provide an opposing view.

The culture of indiscipline is the bane of the software sector. Your company is no exception. Now, coming to the main problem: Has anybody tried to calculate the "cost of indiscipline"? Has anybody attempted to measure the tangible and intangible ill-effects of indiscipline? We need to weigh the benefits vis-a-vis the cost of indiscipline and then come to a conclusion on whether this arrangement is working fine or not.

Perhaps your boss has not bothered to measure the cost of indiscipline. Maybe he did not know how to measure it, and neither did he try to find out. Ignorance is bliss. Hence, the present situation!

You have not directly mentioned attrition but hinted at low attrition. Who knows, maybe those who left were equally talented but could not tolerate this indiscipline. The organization has lost talent regardless.

Sid has advised you on creating a culture of performance. Yes, a good suggestion. The drivers of performance include quality, quantity, consistency, accuracy, delivery, customer satisfaction, etc. Start measuring the performance based on these parameters. These parameters are interconnected and not mutually exclusive. A culture of discipline will naturally evolve. Without this culture, a culture of performance will not thrive.

Thanks,

Dinesh V Divekar

Any small Software Co., working atmosphere is exactly what you say. Software engineers are educated and at the same time vulnerable. From an HR angle, a weak person cannot deal with them, as from their perspective, HR is a weak issue. They do not bother HR, etc., as long as HR people are friendly with them. If HR goes against any software engineer, they will teach a lesson to HR by not cooperating with their project, ultimately affecting the growth of the profitable concern.

I will tell you one small example: In these small software companies, everything is free for employees because they work to bring profitability. My friend shared this practical example. In one similar small company, the cool drink stocks got emptied the previous day. In the morning, some engineers wanted some cool drinks, and the admin guy said he would organize to get them. By that time, the concerned engineer, along with some other engineers, went to the MD and informed him that there were no cool drink stocks at all. The MD then called the admin guy and started shouting. This is just one example of the scenes that software engineers can create.

In any software company, software engineers are the asset of the company. To start a software business, you only need a place, computers, internet or high bandwidth, engineers, and some US marketing tactics. That's all. The government will provide quick licenses, etc., as you bring in foreign exchange through the company's profit.

On the other hand, if you want to start any kind of manufacturing company, you need a big place, labor, and lots of formalities to get approvals, licenses, where the government is also very strict in sanctioning anything.

So, software companies and their engineers are pets for everybody, including any management. Just leave this issue to the management.

Regarding leave and attendance, just politely talk to the concerned individuals and get it done.

Regards, Ramani

Dear Raginiti,

Indiscipline is subjective. If you talk to engineers, they may have their own version.

Take the example of working hours. I had teams that worked with different clients, spread across different geographical regions. Teams working with the US west coast used to come late and stay late. Teams working with Korea and Japan used to come early and go early. A good overlap with the client's working hours was very important in those cases. It could also be the case that some talented engineers feel they are indispensable and take advantage of others.

This situation is best handled by line managers. They are the ones who know what the project requires and the best way to deliver it. Having said that, many front-line managers don't have the maturity to handle these tricky issues well. Ideally, senior managers should mentor and coach line managers in this regard.

However, in many organizations, senior leadership hardly finds time to mentor and coach front-line managers. Often they are busy with finding business, funding, and dealing with customer issues. In such situations, an alternative solution is to find an external coach/mentor who has held senior leadership roles in the same industry.

If you would like to discuss this further, you can contact me at [Login to view].

Thanks,

-Shri

There seems to be a great flow of learning from this post. (Cite Contribution) has asked a really valid and practical question, and others like Sid, Saikumar, Khadir, and Simhan have given key inputs to this discussion.

This is a practical problem. Everywhere, it is believed to have a disciplined, mature, and systematic culture. But the truth is different. I agree with the above points and also believe that the suggestions would help us in creating a strong culture within the organization where we work, regardless of the type.

I also believe that this post would actually keep the viewers thinking constantly about the change required, the patterns in change, the adaptive change, and the transformational change needed in the organization. This would help all viewers engage in a healthy discussion on what elements are required for change to occur.

Thanks

Hello Ragini,

It is really turning out to be a learning discussion, looking forward to the valuable inputs from the learned members of the forum. You have stated that your company is a software company and that the employees are talented but indisciplined. The other members, who seem to be acquainted with the organizational culture of software companies, referred to the "laissez-faire" kind of environment in software companies, which resents restrictions and restraints on the freedom of individual employees as it believes that an employee's potential finds its best expression in a free atmosphere. In other words, it sums up that a culture of free enterprise paves the way for a culture of performance in a software company, given its peculiarities like knowledge base and global time schedules, etc.

If you view the prevailing culture in your company in the context of the thought-provoking contributions to this thread from all enlightened members of the forum, you need to ask a few questions to ensure that you size up the situation properly. They are:

1) Whether in a software company, such a culture of a free atmosphere is inevitable?

2) Is this culture yielding results and delivering goods to the company?

3) If so, whether such a culture of performance can thrive only in a culture of free enterprise?

4) Am I misunderstanding the culture of a free atmosphere for a culture of indiscipline?

5) Am I apprehending that a culture of a free atmosphere, if continued, may lead to a culture of indiscipline, and if so, what are the symptoms that are visible and have given rise to this apprehension?

6) What are the options available to introduce discipline or, positively stating, to bring about a change in the perceptions and behavior of the employees? - (Jot down the options)

8) Which option provides me a win-win situation?

In my view, you need to answer these questions as you are walking on thin ice and need to be doubly sure that you sought a solution but found a problem.

B. Saikumar

HR & Labour Law Advisor

Mumbai

These discussions here remind me of my days at work in two types of educational establishments. One was a college where 9 am to 5 pm attendance, five days a week, was expected whether a tutor had to take lessons or not. The other was a university where no attendance was required, only when classes were being taken and/or meetings were held. However, in the latter, tutors were held responsible to meet the demands of the students in terms of project supervision, guidance, etc.

In the former institution, the staff resented the attendance requirement. I was told that in some Indian colleges, staff are required to attend even when classes are not held to meet AICTE regulations. They just go there, sign, and then go home. People have told me what a waste of time, transport, etc., this stipulation causes.

In the latter university, tutors were available to guide students online and were able to guide them even during summer vacations. Whereas when a staff member is forced to attend five days a week, he or she will be very unwilling to help during vacation time.

Dear Ragini,

I would like to know if any policies have been formulated in your organization, such as the leave policy, working hours, etc. If not, could you please formulate them and ensure that employees understand and are educated regarding the same? Explain to them the benefits of maintaining leave records, compensatory off, working late hours, and also emphasize the advantages of starting the day on time.

With Regards,
Nandini

Generally, the cause for indiscipline is not having company guidelines and decorum. Therefore, one has to set the examples of articles stated above; they need to be considered with good spirit, and suggestions implemented towards employees' behavioral aspects and relation with middle management.

In my opinion, at present, competency rules the organization's goals. In the young generation, we should appreciate the same and guide them to adhere to the company's set guidelines. Secondly, bosses need to establish and participate in teamwork hand in hand to build a strong relationship. Self-dignity, status, and pride come with behavioral aspects, knowledge, and logical solutions.

Dear Rajiniti,

Valuable comments from Sid and Dinesh. To add a little apart from the ones suggested, I have seen HR people in startups or SMEs, especially being a single contributor, will try to exhibit sudden changes. Few of us think that as an HR, we need to bring in changes immediately. We need to understand that we should always have an AS-IS analysis. You can conduct a situational study which comprises morale, cost, productivity, management road-map, culture, etc.

Once you have a valid report, please sit with your management and discuss. Also, please don't initiate any changes to them until they comment on the process. Also, let the management understand that if the culture is demoralized, this can be resolved by certain processes withstand. This is purely because you have mentioned that the employees are good at work and the organization faces minimal attrition. Good luck!

Hi Sapna,

How relevant is your posting with regard to the topic? Just in case you want to say something not related, you can always start a fresh discussion.

Best wishes

Dear All,

I would like to say whether management has permitted or not or known all these "free" culture, a disciplined HR person is answerable in the end for any lapse, such as late attendance or early leaving of staff, absenting duty without prior intimation, or not keeping HR informed.

When everything goes well, no one questions, and everybody will be happy.

When the company suffers losses and is not getting sufficient business, then HR will be asked to address all these undisciplined activities. In that case, it will be very difficult for HR to suddenly bring discipline.

Hence, in my opinion, discipline must be maintained in any IT or non-IT companies. When there is work, employees will have to stay back and complete it. When there is no work, as per policy, they should obtain approval or permission for early leaving or late attendance to their duties.

As some HR professionals have said, HR must discuss the prevailing situation with top management or local HOD and, upon getting their permission, introduce the systems and procedures slowly.

Regards,

S. Rao
Hyderabad

Dear Rajiniti,

Interesting post and interesting answers.

As one of the members mentioned, discipline is a very arbitrary/vague/ambiguous term. It's like one country's soldier is another country's terrorist.

Every good at some point in time becomes bad. There has to be discretion on how to use it.

Understand the current scenario in your organization.

A start-up is always on the lookout for quality people and since it has to manage quality manpower with limited resources, they tend to be lenient on intangible things e.g. flexi timings.

However, as the organization grows, it has to evolve itself as per its peers in the segment, or else it would be difficult to attract talent from competitors.

Next, when it's really big, it can have its own set of rules; the best example is Google.

During these transitions, there will be clashes. You need to draw a proper roadmap to implement your desired change. There should be proper communication as well.

I will give an example:

My organization faced similar issues; we had flexi timings initially. However, as we grew, work increased and it was difficult to maintain flexi timings. There was a lot of resentment about this, especially from the old employees who were performers.

We held a small meeting of all employees (possible in a small org) and put the issue up for debate. Over the discussion, all the pros and cons were discussed, and finally, we reached a consensus. However, easier said than done. While actually implementing this, we faced issues again, mainly from old, loyal, and performing employees.

To overcome this, we started a new award for people coming on time, and punctuality was incentivized. Slowly, there was a sort of competition among people to arrive on time. Those who were not able to cope had to change or perish gradually. You also need to understand that during this process, you may encounter bad experiences as well.

I recommend you talk to your management, understand the current situation/phase of the organization. Give independence to the employees to create their own unique culture and let them be part of the growth story of the organization.

Hope this was of some use to you.

Thanks

Best Regards

Sagar

Hi Sagar,

Good observations on what really happens as organizations grow. I have seen similar situations during mergers and acquisitions. All these situations require mature frontline leadership to deal with changing group dynamics.

Thanks,
Shri

Dear Raginiti,

(Cite Contribution)'s response is precise and complete. Look no further, just chill. No one asked you if there is a "problem." So, don't see it as such.