Dinesh Divekar
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Thread Started by #Sumit Deb1

Hi All,

I'm writing this on behalf of my friend. He had recently switched from a MNC to another in India as full time employee. In earlier company, He had submitted his resignation 2 months prior and served complete 2 months of notice period. On release date, he had submitted his ID, pass etc all to old company HR. At that time, incidentally some scrutiny process started on him, for which HR did not provide any release letter to him. They had asked him to postpone joining by a week.

My friend had waited for a week, but still no result came out. So he had joined new company by showing Resignation acceptance letter from old company HR. New company HR had told him that whenever he would receive the release letter, he should submit that to new Company.

This way one month passed and my friend got settled in new company.

Then one month letter Old company HR called him, informed that the scrutiny has been completed and asked him to collect the release letter. But they are saying they can not give post dated release letter (the date mentioned in original resignation letter from my friend).

This has got my friend into a bigger trouble as now he will be considered for dual employment for 1 month. Isn't it?

We are not sure of the HR laws and regulations.

So, can any of you experts guide us, how to proceed? Whether he should confess this to his new employer? Then he might loose his new job, isn't it? Kindly assist.

Thank you all in advance.
11th February 2016 From India
Dear Sumit,
It appears that you and your friend have got confused unnecessarily. Date on which the relieving letter has been signed has nothing to do with the dates of employment mentioned in the letter.
Suppose your friend has worked in the previous company from 1st Jan 2012 to 31st Dec 2015. Now if the dates are mentioned correctly but the date of relieving letter is 1st Feb 2016, then it cannot be dual employment.
If your friend has not worked in the previous company from 1st Jan 2016 to 31st Jan 2016, then how and why HR will show that he employed in that company?
Therefore, please clarify what would be the verbatim of the relieving letter and then come back again.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar

11th February 2016 From India, Bangalore
Hi Dinesh,

Thank you for your response. I think it is not the date of issueing Release letter I meant.

What I mean was that say my friend had worked in Old Company (say "A") from 1st Jan,2010 to 19th Sep,2015. On 19th July,2015 he served 2 months of prior notice in his resignation letter. So after completing 2 months of notice period, he submitted all ID, pass etc on 19th Sep'14 to Company A. But as I said, due to some scrutiny, HR of company A, didn't provide release letter then.

He waited for 1 week and then Joined new company (say "B") on 29th Sep'2015, showing his resignation acceptance letter from Company A HR.

One month past. Then Company A HR called him and asked to collect his release letter, which had release date on 19th October,2015. Company A HR was not ready to release him on 19th Sep'2015 as he mentioned earlier in his resignation letter.

So during this 20th Sep'15 to 19th Oct'15, my friend had become employee of both Company A and B, though he had submitted all belongings to Company A on 19th Sep.

Question is what should be ideal way to proceed for my friend in this unintended trouble. What will happen to him if new company B will know about this at the time of showing his release letter?

Kindly advice.
11th February 2016 From India
Dear Sumit,
If ex-company's HR is mentioning extra one month in the release letter though employee did not work in his company then that is the insanity of the highest kind. I recommend that your friend should ask for the interview of the MD of that company and sort out the matter.
Other option is that your friend can very well tell that HR to come on this forum and seek clarification on what he is doing is right or not. Tell him that there are HR stalwarts in this forum and he should not find it demeaning if he takes advice from seniors.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
11th February 2016 From India, Bangalore
Hi Dinesh,
Thank you for your response again. As you know that ex-employer HR was not listening to any point of my poor friend, so what he can do further? Whether he should discuss with his new employer HR? Can they fire him due to this reason, purely manipulated from his ex-company? Shall he disclose the truth to his new employer not to payCould you please provide options and pros-cons for each of those options?
He is completely clue less and desperately need your expert advice to keep him career clean.
Thank You,
Sumit
11th February 2016 From India
Dear Sumit,
One solution is given in the above post and that is to seek appointment of the MD of his ex-company and explain his problem. Let us see whether MD drives some sense in the head of his HR professional. There are morons in each profession and HR is no exception.
Secondly, tell your friend to talk to current HR and explain the problem. Tell your friend to persuade current HR to talk to ex-HR. If current HR does not wish to involve in this matter then tell your friend to approach the Labour Office of the area where his company is located. Explain the problem to the Labour Officer (LO). One single call from LO will straighten the ex-HR.
Thanks,
Dinesh Divekar
11th February 2016 From India, Bangalore
Hi,
I have checked with my friend. Now his HR is saying that she can not do any kind of Backdated entry in the system for releasing him. HR is saying as the scrutiny was going on, so he was not released from the system earlier, based on his resignation date. Also mentioning that she was not aware that my friend was joining a new company.
Question is, whether HR from ex-company supposed to know the employee's where about after he has resigned?
Another question is, In People Management system, can HR put backdated release date? Is there any option? Kindly guide with your expertise of People Management System.
Thank You in Advance.
12th February 2016 From India
Dear Sumit,

Ex-HR of your friend's company has done a half job. This headache is result of this half job. On receipt of letter of resignation from the employee, what entry she makes in the HRIS or HRMS is internal matter of HR department. Resigning employee has nothing to do with it. Your friend had resigned, resignation letter was accepted, identity card was returned, he was told to wait for the week and he waited too. But then why there was no communication from HR as to he was still kept on the rolls? Above all, if the scrutiny of some matter was in progress then why she did not send letter stating that your friend's resignation letter has been kept in abeyance?

Ex-HR did not know that your friend will join some other company is churlish argument. Why people resign? Obviously to join the next company and not to sit at home! Nevertheless, your friend also could have communicated that he would like to join the new company to the ex-HR. Partially lapse is from his side also. Nevertheless, I will hold HR more responsible than your friend.

As stated in my previous post, tell your friend to write a letter to the MD of the company to sort out the matter. Else option of Labour Office is always open.

Thanks,

Dinesh Divekar
12th February 2016 From India, Bangalore
This Resembles lack of HR Ownership in closing in the issue on time. HR in MNC not proactive to close the issues on time ,reason this mess.
12th February 2016 From India, Hyderabad
Dear Sumit,

Can you clarify these queries pl ?

1. Did he submit any handing over letter, duly acknowledged by the Co.'A' when he physically left.

2. Did he mark present or logged in in the Co. 'A' after he actually left.

3. What is the date mentioned in 'Resignation accepted' remark on your friend's resignation letter. Is there any other remark on the resignation letter (what exactly the HR endorsed in the resignation letter ?)

4. What is the period/date of completion of the Notice Period as per the terms of conditions of the employment.

5. Any payment of salary or any other perks was received pertaining to the period from the 'resignation accepted date' to the 'date of relieving'.

6. What if the relieving letter is not produced to the new employer. Has he discussed this matter with anyone in the new co.?

7. All these dates you mentioned are just for examples or actual dates. Can't you indicate all these actual dates here.?

8. I believe he should have drawn salary for the period 'in dispute' reg.relieving days in the new co. presumably after completion of the notice period. Is that right ?

Pl.answer these questions with actuals so that we'll apply our mind.
12th February 2016 From India, Bangalore
Reading through the question and answer on Dinesh's friend's case and worry on dual employeement, I do have some doubt in mind.
Practically, was the friends being paid and acknowledge for receiving the payment?
If the ex-company cannot prove that the friend was paid during that month, then was it an employrement?
13th February 2016 From Malaysia, Klang
Dear Sumit,
Under the circumstances as explained by you, we feel there is no harm as to your Friend cannot disclose all the facts to New Company's HR & his present Manager.
We are not much aware as what is required to be done under such type of circumstances.
In fact, there can be another solution, if the HR or Management of old Company can be requested to show this period as "scrutiny Period" where the employee was not Physically on their Roll.
Seniors contributing Members are requested to offer their views also.
Regards
Optimus Consultants
15th February 2016 From India
There are few pertinent questions to be answered.
Mere 'resignation accepted' does not suo motto means relieved. What is to be noted is the 'last working day' after completion of relevant notice period, unless otherwise waived/cut short or the actual date of separation as per the roll. Till such time an employee will be considered as on roll and therefore would be entitled for salary, if it is not marked absent. In the absence of relevant details it is difficult to draw conclusions and to suggest meaningfully. The onus on whether or not any dual employment exists or not would depend on answers to these questions.
16th February 2016 From India, Bangalore
Hi,
Ask your friend to Old HR to issue the letter on latest date with details of employment period in the body of letter, so automatically this period indicates the last working day in his employment period.
in this case both parties purpose will be served.
Thanks
TaskPro Solutions
16th February 2016 From India, Hyderabad
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