Dinesh Divekar
Business Mentor, Consultant And Trainer
Saswatabanerjee
Partner - Risk Management
V.Raghunathan
Process Industry Consultant / Soft Skill
Gopinath Varahamurthi
Mindhour Partner, Ass.professor/adm. Officer,
Binubabu
Hr Professional
Mkandukuri
Director - Hr
Tajsateesh
Recruitment/talent Acquisition, Career Counselling
Nashbramhall
Learning & Teaching Fellow (retired)
NK SUNDARAM
Soft Skill Trainer / Hr Consultant - India
Aussiejohn
Trainer
SAIBHAKTA
Retired From Air India
+3 Others

Dear All,

My daughter completed her CA in first attempt in Nov. 2013 and opted to go for IIM. Unfortunately she was not able to secure the seat in the college of her choice so decided not to go for MBA. She accepted that she has not taken seriously.Then she started looking for the job in Pune, Mumbai but not able pass interview for 3-4 companies. She lost interest in attending interview and now a days not even applying for any openings.

Now she has enrolled for CFA and currently preparing for November exam.Through out her educational career she was always on top rank. She passed her SSC, HSC and B.COM with distinction. I have tried my best to convince her but all in vain. Can anyone suggest a reputed institute where she will be able to learn technics of attending interview & develop her personality. There are many I can see on net but I am looking for the best one anywhere in Pune or Mumbai.

I will appreciate if any one of our member from Finance background can help her to suggest openings available in their company. In her article ship she was considered to be the best among there group. She completed her article ship from one of the top firm from Pune.

Best regards,

VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah

Dear Mr Vijay,

After going through the entire case of your daughter I can infer that what she needs is counselling. Therefore, I recommend you taking help of professional counsellor. Finance professionals may not be good in career counselling. If you had been from Bangalore, I would have recommended you a very good counsellor who would have enhanced her self-esteem. Secondly, you have not mentioned, why your daughter could not get through the job interview even though she was top ranker all along in her education.

General comments: - The story of poster's daughter shows that bookish knowledge does not build one's personality. Partially it bogs down to our education system. Our education system makes students concerned only for the examination and nothing else. Generally most of the written examinations last for three hours. Therefore, all that students have to do is to learn how to manage those 180 minutes of their life. Nevertheless, what our education system misses is application part of the knowledge. When students do not have clue as to where to apply the knowledge, when to apply and how to apply they develop fear of this kind. Student's brains are not grounds to dump knowledge. Our education system is yet to realise this. In contrast, western countries teach how to use someone else's knowledge and prosper!

Thanks,

Dinesh Divekar


From India, Bangalore
Hello Vijay,

I join other members in sharing your concern about your daughter.

Her academic background & the current situation.....as you described.....don't seem to jell in a few aspects.

There are a few points that need clarity.

1] What are her non-academic interests/hobbies? Pl mention reg 'has she been a bookworm while studying', 'did she ever have any friends in school/college as well as outside', 'did she participate in any extra-curricular activities @ school/college', etc.

2] Prima-facie, she seems to have a semblance of over-confidence thus far--not very uncommon in top-scoring students. This is corroborated by what you mentioned--"she was not able to secure the seat in the college of her choice so decided not to go for MBA" AND "She accepted that she has not taken seriously".

Quite often, such top-notch students take things for granted.....in whatever they do, UNTIL they get hit by reality that the efforts HAVE TO MATCH the goals, irrespective of past achievements.

3] Did you have a clear & open discussion with her? Is her interest towards a job OR academics?

I clearly see a sign [I MAY be wrong....but THINK am right] of family pressure to get into a job than doing any further studies.

You mentioned she is preparing for CFA Exams in November.........then what does this line of your's "I have tried my best to convince her but all in vain" mean? Convince for/against WHAT?

4] What's the basis on which you conclude that she HAS THE NEED TO develop her personality?

Frankly, many....NOT most......parents THINK they know their children's aspirations & interests the best--BASED ON THEIR views of life. And quite often, they realize that they were wrong after it's too late......that what's good for goose MAY NOT necessarily be good for the gander.

The pity in the whole situation is that the parents SURELY & DEFINITELY have the interest of the child in mind......so the intent is not & never is suspect......only the failure to see that the goals & methods COULD be different.

And the other pitiable aspect in this is that NO child.....unless there's been any past history of child abuse/disregard.......likes to say 'NO' to his/her parents when he/she knows what's in their minds. Typically, they just 'keep shut' which actually leads to the whole issue taking different turns & possible WRONG diagnosis of the situation.

I am NOT saying this from theory......I have practical experiences of having handled such situations [some which I managed to avert/correct well in time & some just had to watch when whole careers/lives were literally going for a toss].

Frankly, at this point of time, I DON'T see any need for any counselling or special courses....

Suggest pl give your responses to the above queries.

Rgds,

TS
From India, Hyderabad
// Student's brains are not grounds to dump knowledge. Our education system is yet to realise this. In contrast, western countries teach how to use someone else's knowledge and prosper! //
True words Dineshji. Thanks for your post, also I thank all our august members for their concern for this vibrant topic.
From India, New Delhi
Dear Vijay,

Our learned members have given good suggestions and raised valid questions; please let me add a couple of questions before making a comment. Has your daughter asked for feedback from the companies as to why she was not successful? In the West most companies respond if asked. As I left India long ago, I do not know if organisations give such feedback. However, it's worth trying.

Has she tried in the company where she did her "articleship"? If not, why not?

If I am correct, 90% plus seats in IIMs are bagged by students with an engineering background and thus the competition is very stiff. KIndly read and digest info at Engineers will continue to dominate IIM campuses | Business Standard News

It's very easy to lose heart when faced with failure for top rank students. However, your daughter should not fall into the vicious cycle.

For the time being, let her concentrate on the CFA exam, if that's what she prefers.

Like others have mentioned, In India, parents try to influence what children have to do and also keep stressing on becoming a TOPPER in the class. However, my experience in the West is to let children do what they want and not compare them with others and not expect them to become TOPPERS.
From United Kingdom
Hello Simhan,
Reg your comments "Has your daughter asked for feedback from the companies as to why she was not successful?"--forget about it.
Most Companies in India don't even give the feedback 'that's meaningful' to those who refer the candidates [including Agencies], what to speak of the interviewees themselves.
I stressed 'that's meaningful' since saying 'technically rejected or not selected' can mean anything under the Sun.
And there are many Companies that don't really care about the sensibilities of the individual.....the word 'rejected' is used in the same sense & breath as they would use 'selected', even though there are many ways to convey the same meaning without disheartening the candidate.
I guess you can't win them all until the Companies themselves realize that they owe something to the interviewees.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear TS, our daughter is a family physician and the General Practices generally give feedback, when asked. Same goes for some companies.
Dear Nathrao and TS, you are both right. Till companies realise that even in a buyers' market they owe some explanation to rejected candidates, as to how they could improve their chances of selection, things will not change. The candidates get frustrated.
From United Kingdom
Hello Vijay,

Just to add to what I mentioned/suggested earlier.

Though I am NOT a Finance guy, by virtue of being in a profession where learning about the latest trends & disruptive sectors/fields that proliferate all over all the time--as a necessity & daily routine than as a hobby--I can say that CFA is not something that anyone can get thru.

It's highly valued in Top-notch Companies--needless to say, it's also very tough to clear & is NOT for the average students.

Here's the Link for your ready reference:

CFA Program

In addition to the effort involved, the only other aspect that needs to be kept in mind would be the timeframes....it takes ~2 yrs to attain the CFA tail after one's name.

Though this MAY seem obtrusive, I would venture to add: when the kid is raring to fly, as a parent, it wouldn't be appropriate to hold him/her like a crab & keep pulling him/her to hold him/her down. The best current-day's example for this would be Saina Nehwal......

Like V.Raghunathan mentioned, pl do give your views.

Rgds,

TS
From India, Hyderabad
With a long history of training people in job search and interview skills, I can concur with most of the comments posted thus far.

The issue of self-confidence, and ability to cope with interviews is a tricky one. Some people are natural talkers, others shy and reserved. There are no easy answers.

But, as others have pointed out, preparation is the key to success, and will go a long way towards enabling a candidate to perform well. But, in truth, that really only works when employers have a proper set of questions based on the skills and experience needed to do the job. Then the candidate can prepare confidently, based on the position description. However, too many interviewers go down the path of asking totally irrelevant questions that have nothing to do with the job in question. And there is this idiotic trend of asking things like how many cabs are there in New York City or something like that.

When faced with that sort of rubbish, it is not surprising that candidates fall in a heap, and lose confidence. I am not disagreeing that candidates need to show ability to think on their feet, be creative, and to also show resilience. However, there are better ways of doing it.

I am not sure what it is like in India, but in the West, there is a growing tendency for parents to try and shield their children from hurt and disappointment. There are no winners and losers, everyone gets a prize, etc. Wrapping children in bubble wrap does nothing for their ability to cope with the real world, and that is sad.

I am sure everyone of us here on CiteHR has been unsuccessful at more than one interview. We try to learn from our mistakes, we pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and start all over again. It is part of our growth and development as human beings. It gives us the resilience to cope with the bigger disasters that can befall us along the way.

Finally on the subject of feedback from interviews. Many employers will not give feedback. That's a given. However, sometimes it is in the way you ask. I always tell people that if they decide to seek feedback, you start by thanking the employer for the opportunity of the interview. Then you ask what you would need to do to be successful next time a position like this comes up. It won't always work, but sometimes disarms the interviewer enough to coax them into giving some pointers. It goes without saying that you never burn your bridges. They may have liked you, but another candidate was stronger on THIS occasion.
From Australia, Melbourne
Vijay,

I think the problem lies with the fact that your daughter has a sense of overconfidence, probably from the praise that you and your family heaped on her. She was topper in school and college. Well it is immaterial. Was she a top 10 ranked in CA ? If not she is at the same level more or less as 1000s of other CA looking for jobs in the market.

So,who told her that every company out there is just waiting for grabbing her ? How did she get convinced that she would get a job in the first interview she gave ? I suspect it was you. Today the demand for freshers is low as experienced persons are available all over the place. Attending 20 interviews for a job is common.

From your post it appears to me that the problem was created by you. Like you are stressing on her interview skills. Which means you are still thinking that she should have got the first job. And that its her interview skills alone that was the problem.

Now, first disabuse your self of the fact that the job is easy to get. Explain to her that the longer she is out of job the more difficult it will be to get one. So she needs to get a job quickly even if it's not what she was told is worthwhile for her to do.

Try to see if the firm she did articles with has a place for her.

If not, sit with her and go through recruitment advt to see which one is worth applying. And help her do that. Ensure that she goes with the understanding that she may not get the job and that attending more interviews is important for when she goes for the one she wants.

Btw, there will hardly be jobs for CFA in pune.
From India, Mumbai
Hello John,
Your line 'But, in truth, that really only works when employers have a proper set of questions based on the skills and experience needed to do the job' reminds me of Einstein's Quote: "The perfect Fool can always ask what's beyond the Wisest to answer" :-)
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
Many parents make a mistake.. they breed race horses, not street smart children. I am sorry to say this but your daughter is a typical example of this. As many learned professional colleagues have pointed out, a smart child is someone who has developed interests in lot of things apart from curriculum. Debating skills, oratory, team working, games, activities. It is not sufficient or enough to come out as top ranker in academics. That is not just the life.. there is something beyond that. I know of many kids for whom books are the only companions, who become book worms ultimately. Books are essential only to enhance and enrich their knowledge. But they end up as total failures when they face competition in this world.. There are lot of training institutions, experienced HR professionals who can guide your daughter to become an extrovert. She should mix with both genders, talk to them, interact with them. You give her a free hand in meeting people... I call this Controlled Freedom. Let her make career choices, in which our interference should be least or minimal.

Best wishes
From India
Hello NK Sundaram,

I am not so sure about the conclusion about the introvertness of Vijay's daughter.....while this COULD be ONLY ONE of the possibilities, I didn't want to make any assumption. Hence my very First query asking about her extra-curricular activities.

My reading, based on what Vijay mentioned, is just that it's a case of the father's & the daughter's views of the future NOT syncing.

Another way of looking @ her not performing well in the interviews COULD be this.....based purely on psychology: when someone doesn't have any interest in something, he/she tends to go about THRU THE MOTIONS of doing the task, just to satisfy the other person(s). The more the person is forced to do what he/she doesn't like, the more the tendency to resist......in the way he/she DEEMS possible. In the long-run, this is bound to be dangerous for the poor kid inculcating in him/her a sort of rebellious response mechanism even in normal situations.

I am sure everyone knows the tantrums of a year-old kid...when he/she isn't given what he/she wants/likes. Except that in the case of adults, the response/reaction is camouflaged in more sophistication.

Vijay hasn't responded so far....so unless he responds clearly & openly, I guess we are only running around in circles giving suggestions based on 'premises & presumptions'.

Rgds,

TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Vijay,
I wonder what you do for a living, as you have not responded to the suggestions made and questions raised, even 2 days after posting the query. Please do not get hurt with comments made and questions raised about your approach and your daughter's achievement. Such questions arise and comments are made when people post messages which do not give complete information about themselves and the scenario and we make assumptions. My tutor had told me not to "ASS U ME"; that's how he spelt the word assume. He meant that when our assumptions are wrong it makes "an ASS out of you and me".
Like Aussiejohn has said, I know students who have gone for 50+ interviews without success.
From United Kingdom
Very true Nathrao, But in the meanwhile we all have a good time sharing our views, learning from one another and have another thread of good academic value :-)
From India, Mumbai
Dear All,

Thanks a lot for the suggestions and your views on my daughters case. I was not able to open the link for your reply so got delayed to reply you. Every one has provided valuable suggestions and there is a lot to learn from every post. I accept that though she is very good in academics, she is not much social type of person. Secondly some of the members concluded that as typical parents we forced our terms on her which is not true.

My father gave freedom to select my career so as I also gave freedom to my daughter. Surprisingly while studying in Dubai, she decided her desire for CA when she passed her 9th exam and even decided which college she will enroll in Pune. Again once enrolled for article ship at particular firm everything went as per her wish until passing her CA. So we as parents we never forced our terms on her.

Regarding interview, we tried to check with her and understand where exactly went wrong. The first one I am aware of that she gone through all steps and selected but when they asked her to work in odd shift ( afternoon 12 to night 8) she told them she will think about it. After that when we used to asked her, she was getting irritated which I have seen in all teenagers.

For sure because of less exposure to outside world, not interacting with different people she is a bit scared to open herself. But again it is not that we are conservative but she herself don't want to socialize.

Thanks once again for all of you for valuable comments. I will also look in to myself whether I am doing anything wrong unintentionally.

Regards to all,

VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
Dear Friend,

All have done here in, your concern for your daughter is really appreciable, yet, try to put your daughter on her own, Every bird fly its own.. let her come out with good questions of why she could not go through, despite of having a good academic achievement? Ask her go to her teachers/mentors, certainly some one find the thread where it is woven weak they will guide her, also, never trust who praise her as, the praise is the weapon deliberately put her down. Attending interview and preparing for the same is a matter of persistence approach, attitude, presence of mind, good communication and confidence. She should also know the company with whom she is going to work well in advance at least about the product/service/market presence/brand value etc., this will help her in going through the interview.

Further, never ask why she could not get through the interview, make her, your kit is not this, you get the more and your goal is beyond this one, ask her to sit, get a note book make her to write the incident(interview) in detail whatever she remember this skill certainly help her where she should have given a better response, also this will enhance her language of presence. A self analysis is a must for her life.

You know there is always a perception that we are being interviewed by the most skillful, intelligent, the best in all counts..the reality is the contra of our presumption, sometimes, we are being interviewed by, who never now the subject those are the occasion frustrating, belittle and unpraiseworthy, but, they are at the helm, they teach us patience, how to deal the circumstances etc., these are the things your daughter will learn by her own, you should have a beautiful talk, be friendly with her..

As regard your concern for best coaching for soft skills, now a days a lot of people available who counsel your daughter, guide her for a better prospects for that get in touch with the local teachers they will guide you, some people are being trained by online try to find out a good one, never go for the best, because, you are not the one can judge it..soft skill is a subject is becoming familiar in the recent past. Also, go for short term courses for skill development...

best of luck...we are human be humane...
From India, Arcot
Dear All,

It will be difficult for me to answer all the questions from members but trying to reply some of them

I agree with Mr. Diwakar views about our current education system. As an individual we canít change the system but need go along with it. For sure she needs counselling and thatís the reason I requested you to suggest a good counselor from Pune or Mumbai. I even told her several time to be open, tell me if I am mistaking or anything you want to speak but she does not open at all. If I will speak 100 lines ( not anything harsh language or screaming) she will answer either yes or no may be once or twice thatís all. It is possible she has gone into depression.

To answer for Mr. Tajsateesh as already mentioned she is not much in socializing but she has good friend circle. Her first preference is always study. She hardly engaged in any extracurricular activities. I tried to speak with her several time but she does not open at all. It is possible that as an Engineer my expressions are different than her thinking who is from finance. I convinced her to attend the interviews, thatís all. I am not forcing her to be on job.

To answer Mr. Natharao, I observed that she is always well prepared before an interview. I even cross checked with her as curiosity and found she had all details of company before attending interview. The only problem may be she must be lacking in confidence and decisions making ability.

To answer Nashbramhall, she has not approached to the firm where she had done article ship. When asked with her why not joining your same firm, she told me that she was given only specific type of companies for auditing and not the MNC so the experience what she got like charitable trust, hospital etc. , MNC people are not ready to accept.

To answer Mr. Sundaram, we never put any conditions, restrictions on her. We have given freedom to her to choose her friends irrespective of gender.

Unfortunately I was not able to reply you all because of link problem. Thanks a lot again.

VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
Hello Vijay,

W.r.t. your line "Secondly some of the members concluded that as typical parents we forced our terms on her which is not true", I don't think anyone 'concluded' on this aspect. Some, including myself, ONLY 'presumed'......in the absence of clarity or response from you.

However, glad that this is NOT one of the possibilities for the current situation.

Coming to the actual solution to the situation you are facing, have you checked whether her TRUE interest lies in academics? Some persons wish to settle in the teaching line.....and attending job I/Vs usually is just a backup plan they build-up.

Also, suggest SOFTLY ascertain her REASONS for opting for CFA.......there NEVER are any 'right' or 'wrong' reasons for career choices.

Every choice has it's own set of Pros & Cons.

An example could be the I/V she attended....from HER perspective, the odd shift of afternoon 12 to night 8 COULD be a Con--even though I don't think so, since in today's world there's no guarantee that one can return back @ 5.00 PM IF one wants Corporate jobs. Late sittings are the norm now. But it's SHE who will have to work, not me or you or anyone else.

OR is it that something else happened in the I/V that she's not sharing? Just a thought.

Generally it's wise to keep in touch with your kids' friends.......

As long as the individual knows what he/she is getting into, any career choice is OK.......presuming that it's NOT into something illegal. The idea is to ensure any decision is a well-informed decision......that's all. There's a plethora of career choices that WE may think is crazy, but the individual concerned gets such a elation being in that line. I recollect a recent case of an Indian Mountain climber [the ONLY one who climbed ALL the highest peaks in all the Continents]......Babu I think.....who was found dead after 2-3 weeks in a Mountain range in South America--I was surprised to read that he studied in IIT AND also in IIM. What he found satisfaction in had nothing to do with what he studied.

If you have seen the CFA Link that I mentioned in my earlier posting, it should be clear that it takes anywhere from 2-3 yrs to become a full-fledged CFA. She should be ready for it......including planning out how she wants to handle her free time [there's no college here to attend & have regular timelines--she has to do a lot of self-planning of her time].

All the Best.

Rgds,

TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Vijay,
I am not sure whether it's a good idea or not. Kindly mention to her that you raised a query at CiteHR and you have had some suggestions and questions raised. If she is interested, she will access the website and read for herself the comments made and also what you have said.
From United Kingdom
I second Simhan.
That will convey Vijay's concern for her AS WELL AS give her a chance to analyse for herself on the various options she has.
She's after all an adult now & should be able to make decisions herself to a large extent.
And I don't think anything mentioned by the members or Vijay in this thread has any content that should be the cause of worry or apprehension for her.......it's ALL well-meant & keeping her interest in mind.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Nashbramhall, Thanks for the suggestion. I have already informed her about posting thread on Cite.HR and also conveyed some of the messages posted by our members. Thanks once again. VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
Dear Mr Vijay,
You have answered most of the queries that were raised as the thread had progressed.
I hope you have responded to Mr.Jacob also seperately.
His name was suggested, since you wanted a senior member with a financial background.
This request was in your opening message.
Mr Jacob is great motivator and had personally confirmed to me about his writing to you.
V.Raghunathan
From India
Dear Vijay,
I dont see it as her weakness on technics.....it is more on her being introvert and not able to mingle with people. Please make her go through public speaking course which would be couple of weeks. She needs to feel confident from within, rest will fall in place.
From India, Hyderabad
One major flaw in this forum is that the communication is always one-sided, in a large majority of the cases. The person who originally posted his or her query, does not even have the basic courtesy of acknowledging the various comments posted by people, who are otherwise busy with their own commitments. Still we take time off from our schedule and ensure that we share our opinion, thoughts and ideas so that the person who posted his or her query gets a variety of choices in front of him/her. Anyway, 'courtesy' is a word which is slowly vanishing from the earth and also from the English Dictionary !!!
From India
Hello Sundaram,

You are right.

However, the way I have been looking @ MY participation in this Forum is: There are 2 types of people....Takers & Givers.

Most of those who take time off from their busy schedules belong to the 'Givers' category & it's upto the Originators WHETHER to acknowledge the suggestions & MORE importantly, become 'Givers' too along the way.

The ONLY parameter I apply to my opinions & participation is follow what's said in the Gita--'Patra Daan' & 'Apatra daan'.......meaning 'deserving' & undeserving' Giving [be it suggestion, money, idea, opinion, etc, etc]. One of the MAIN reasons I begin my participation in any discussion/thread by asking queries is this.......the other being to get better clarity of the issue/situation AND the context. If you notice, so many new members want to know on ways to beat the Rules when it's inconvenient for him/her........be it absconding without getting hit, how to skip the Bond without paying a dime, how to punish the Company legally for his/her mistake & so on & so forth. There are others who ask innocuous queries [masking out the ACTUAL issue] & misuse the suggestions given.

The ONLY WAY the Seniors in this Forum can inculcate the habit among those who raise issues/queries with half-baked/incomplete inputs is to DESIST from giving suggestions right away. Once this becomes a habit for the likes of us, ONLY THEN will the habit of giving the FULL & TRUTHFUL details by thread initiators begin & continue.

Else, this topic will keep getting discussed, by those around then, even when CiteHR celebrates it's Centenary [seriously].

Had this been an Organization, one would have templates, formats, etc.....but in such public Forums, that's both tough & impractical.

Rgds,

TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Mr. Sundaram,

It is not correct that the communication is one sided and I do not have courtesy to even reply to the posting. I already tried to reply almost everyone's suggestions. Off course it is not possible to reply every member like how we chat in "what's app". I thanks to everyone who provided the valuable information. I posted 2 replies with sufficient explanation and situation but it is not correct to accuse anyone that the person doesnít have courtesy to reply the members.

Instead of replying every post I preferred to wait for 3-4 postings together and reply them all in one post, which I am doing. There are always two sides for the coin. Secondly I am hardcore technical person who is a bit not very familiar with HR terms. So some of the postings are really tough for me to understand.

Mr. Raghunathan, my daughter already contacted Mr. Jacob and both of them in communication with each other. She also agreed to look for some personality development classes.

Regards to all.

VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
Hello Vijay,
I think you got the intent & content of Sundaram's posting all wrong.
He was referring to the general direction postings in this Forum have been going in the recent past.....and so was MY reply posting too.
It surely WASN'T directed @ you or your issue @ hand......looks like more of a unintended comm gap.
Rgds,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Mr. Tajsateesh,
Cite HR. is a nice platform for the people like me who are not basically from HR department. We all are in the forum to share the information, advise & knowledge and not to pin point an individual. We are not in a court where we need to give an explanation but the sentence "The person who originally posted his or her query, does not even have the basic courtesy of acknowledging the various comments posted by people, who are otherwise busy with their own commitments" is for sure not a general statement but pinpointing an individual.
It's request to everyone kindly do not stretch this subject anymore. I have respect for all the members who regularly post their valuable advices and want to keep the good terms with you all forever.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
Mr.. Vijay.... As Mr. Tajsateesh has correctly pointed out, it is my general opinion I was talking about and in particular about you. As a parent, I too fully understand the mental agony and turmoil you must be passing through... A girl not getting a proper job commensurate with here qualifications in this modern competitive world, is as good as she not getting married despite reaching the correct age. The concern is genuine. What we expected was a simple acknowledgement for having received the inputs (perhaps more than what you expected !). As they say, giving advice to others is the most easiest thing in this world. However, in a forum like this, which is full of professionals, the advice given will be based more on their knowledge, skills and experienced gained over the years. We do not give any off-the-cuff advice... like a remedy / cure for 'cold' !

I am happy that your daughter is on the right track and we wish her all success. These days, I understand the CA branches in various major cities conduct lot of soft skill training programmes like presentation skills (my son is a CA and I know it for certain !) to further enhance the soft skills of CAs. You can explore this as well.

Best wishes
From India
Dear Mr. Sundaram,
Nicely explained and thanks for the same. It is possible that my mind is not in position to understand or differentiate the terms so the conversation took the wrong direction.
Before she refused to go for any personality development programs but at least now she agreed and working on it. I can see changes in her & 100 % sure that she will be back on the track.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
I also post on the assumption that the thread will build a knowledge base for,the future, where someone with a similar problem will get the answer directly. So for me, the original poster responding or not does not matter as such. But I get irritated seeing the takers posting a query that is covered so many times. Just see how many times the query "what should be the correct salary structure" has come !!
And vijay, this is not about you.

From India, Mumbai
Hello Nathrao,

I missed out reading this line you mentioned earlier 'I frankly admit learning more by being in the position of "giver" and also from other learned members".

This doesn't just apply to you alone......it's very natural that Givers ALWAYS learn/gain MORE than takers for the simple reason that any Giver normally tries to evaluate & analyse what others have suggested & how are his/her ideas/gyan different from others. So, in the process, it's but natural that he/she gains/learns a lot more than he/she is giving.

While any Taker's tendency is to look JUST for the solution to his/her problem in what's being offered by others......usually IGNORING all other points/ideas [that he/she THINKS is irrelevant to his/her current issue/problem]--in short their focus is very narrow & short-term. While there's nothing wrong per se in this, such people loose out on the larger picture of any issue/situation.

And quite often, this comes-out very clearly from his/her postings that lack in clarity, etc.

This is differentiated from those who are currently Takers but have the potential to become Givers along the way.......

The best current example I can think of is Vijay....who has realized that the initial inputs he provided were leading to many presumptions that were either untrue or only partially true & has cared to give more detailed inputs. I am sure he has learned much more NOW than when he initiated this thread......when the objective would have been to just get a solution to his daughter's problem.

Rgds,

TS
From India, Hyderabad
""This doesn't just apply to you alone......it's very natural that Givers ALWAYS learn/gain MORE than takers for the simple reason that any Giver normally tries to evaluate & analyse what others have suggested & how are his/her ideas/gyan different from others. So, in the process, it's but natural that he/she gains/learns a lot more than he/she is giving""
I do agree with what you say.
But did I give the impression that I only learn more by being a "giver"
From India, Pune
No Nathrao — you DIDN’T. Sometimes, English language is such a poor communicator that meanings change :-) Our Indian languages are far better to convey the nuances. Rgds, TS
From India, Hyderabad
Dear Vijay,

Your daughter tried to get into IIM but unfortunately she couldn't make it in the first attempt. As you know it is really difficult to get into IIMs since the Quality and Reputation of IIM Education matter utmost among corporate world. Many candidates succeed after more than one attempt in CAT. The entrance exams consist of written test, Group discussion, Personal Interviews etc. Before attending the CAT a candidate should understand the extreme competition involved in this Examination.

Now, your daughter is a CA by profession. Becoming a CA is also really difficult since it deals with lot of subjects in detail. Becoming a CA in the first attempt is really prestigious. If a candidate can be so, obviously it means, he or she is highly intellectual. So there is no point in worrying about. Only problem is lack of soft skills.

If she is really interested to have a corporate career in finance domain, she needs more knowledge in the concerned subject than soft skills. Luckily your daughter has it and she has proved it before everyone. Now it can be nurtured with the help of Soft skill trainers who are available in almost all metros in India. The knowledge one possesses, which needs to be presented and implemented in corporate world when it is required, depends upon the confidence level of the professional, who is taking up the concerned role. That means no matter how much knowledgeable we are, it become absolutely useless if we are not competent enough to use it as and when required owing to lack of confidence.

Your daughter attended some interviews but unable to make it and now not even ready to attend anymore interviews show, she may be having lack of soft skill training and confidence that made her desperate in making career in corporate world.

She can have many options.

She can become perfectly employable by both in terms of knowledge and soft skills competency. A set of confidence building measures are part of the programme may be available with Soft Skills Training / counselling institutes nearby your home.

Or she can be an independent Financial Consultant by practicing under a senior CA for some time and start a consultancy of her own which does not require that much degree of soft skills needed for a corporate career.
However, in my opinion, it is better to have some soft sill training for your daughter. It will obviously help her to deal with bold mind in complicated situations in future whether as a consultant or as a corporate professional.
Discuss the matter with your daughter in detail. Let her decide her course of action.

Thank you
From India, Thiruvananthapuram
Dear Mr. Binubabu,
Thanks a lot for your reply and valuable suggestions. I was really touched with the response I received from all the members and has to accept that I would have been ask your help long before.
Things has changed a lot now. She is looking forward for many things now and both i.e. me and my wife can see a lots of changes in her. As mentioned earlier, she has started looking for the soft skill & personality development programs. Regarding your suggestion about working for sometime with a CA firm and then starting our own practice was my first suggestion to her which she refused. I tried to explain her with various angles but she was not able to accept. Still I am optimistic that she will understand the benefits of having our own firm but on the other hand don't want to force my terms on her.
With this message I would like to thanks all the members who took out their precious time to post their suggestions.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
Dear Mr Vijay, I have retired from a CPSU and presently living in Pune.Your daughter can contact me if she wants on my phone 09433722046.
From India, New Delhi
Dear Mr Vijay,
Let me congratulate on her topping.
1. She should once understand when she could easily clear the difficult papers , interviews are nothing for her.
2. Failure is the great success to gain the experience
3. Getting a job in a single attemp is nothing great achievement but with learned experience it is really great feeling & confidence we will have.
4. She should practice to face her in the mirror & speak confidentally & have some mock interviews at home
5. One positive thought will change the entire scenario.
6. Try & Try untill we get success rather giving up in between.
7. She is in confusion stage of doing CA , MBA & CFA . what is her final goal to achieve? She should also try to understand her confusion
Regards
NVN
From India , Hyderabad
Dear NVN Lakshmi,
Thanks for your reply. As mentioned in my earlier post, she will be joining the personality development- soft skill program very shortly. As per my observation she is not used to any defeat so a series of failures might have depressed her. After first failure she must be thinking of her previous interview and that must have created problem for her.
She is looking positive now which can be the outcome of the suggestion made by our members. Your post will also be helpful for her to think on the points you raised. Regarding CA, MBA or CFA, the same debate we had in past but I backed up because I am a technical person. For sure she must be knowing better than me about future in finance studies. Also at some stages she was influenced by her friends and so took some wrong decisions.
Thanks a lot once again.
Best regards,
VIJAY
From United Arab Emirates, Ras Al Khaimah
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