Dear Friends,
As a recruitment consultant, I have often faced some serious issues from some HR professionals, and I feel concerned about the deteriorating ethical standards in the HR community.
These are as follows:
1. An URGENT position needing to be closed ASAP is put on "HOLD" soon after we have sent some very good and relevant profiles. (Maybe they have found what they were looking for, go ahead and search for that person's profile on their own.)
2. They stop giving feedback to the profiles sent after you have sent a sizable number of relevant profiles to another "URGENT" position. A week later, they declare it closed, with no explanation given.
3. The most relevant profile will always be "duplicate," even though no one has contacted the candidate for the position. There are a lot of other issues (asking for commission, using consultants to create a database of candidates, delayed payments, non-payments, etc.) where we have strong feelings of foul play and unfair/unethical practices, taking the poor consultant for a ride on various pretexts and sometimes openly.
The consultant bears the brunt as he does not wish to lose a client and be seen as being suspicious. Moreover, the consultants competing with each other have no way out but to give in to the whims and fancies of the clients and the HR professionals.
In our case, we dropped such clients immediately!
I would request everybody's inputs and experiences in this regard.
My question is why can't we Indians practice what we preach? And why don't we have any problems following unethical practices towards a service provider we feel is subservient to us?
Can anything be done to improve the life of the poor recruitment consultant? Is there a way out for them?
Yours truly,
Capt Chand Pathak
9818696454
From India, Lucknow
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4As a recruitment consultant, I have often faced some serious issues from some HR professionals, and I feel concerned about the deteriorating ethical standards in the HR community.
These are as follows:
1. An URGENT position needing to be closed ASAP is put on "HOLD" soon after we have sent some very good and relevant profiles. (Maybe they have found what they were looking for, go ahead and search for that person's profile on their own.)
2. They stop giving feedback to the profiles sent after you have sent a sizable number of relevant profiles to another "URGENT" position. A week later, they declare it closed, with no explanation given.
3. The most relevant profile will always be "duplicate," even though no one has contacted the candidate for the position. There are a lot of other issues (asking for commission, using consultants to create a database of candidates, delayed payments, non-payments, etc.) where we have strong feelings of foul play and unfair/unethical practices, taking the poor consultant for a ride on various pretexts and sometimes openly.
The consultant bears the brunt as he does not wish to lose a client and be seen as being suspicious. Moreover, the consultants competing with each other have no way out but to give in to the whims and fancies of the clients and the HR professionals.
In our case, we dropped such clients immediately!
I would request everybody's inputs and experiences in this regard.
My question is why can't we Indians practice what we preach? And why don't we have any problems following unethical practices towards a service provider we feel is subservient to us?
Can anything be done to improve the life of the poor recruitment consultant? Is there a way out for them?
Yours truly,
Capt Chand Pathak
9818696454
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Captain,
Very truly said, and it's a damn fact. Most of them will be doing at least 2 of the mentioned points. Even they will not be knowing the entire process in their organization when being diplomatically asked. Some of the HR will be thinking they are running the show for the company and are the cause for the revenue. And some of the HR have forgotten that they have worked in a staffing firm or consultancy before joining an MNC.
At the end of the day, everyone should be ethical, fair to others, and successful.
From India, Bangalore
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Very truly said, and it's a damn fact. Most of them will be doing at least 2 of the mentioned points. Even they will not be knowing the entire process in their organization when being diplomatically asked. Some of the HR will be thinking they are running the show for the company and are the cause for the revenue. And some of the HR have forgotten that they have worked in a staffing firm or consultancy before joining an MNC.
At the end of the day, everyone should be ethical, fair to others, and successful.
From India, Bangalore
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It's KALYUG, and these things are bound to happen. All the HR have become arrogant of their power. They will now suffer in a cauldron of boiling oil very soon. Don't worry, as you sow so shall you reap.
From India, Pune
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From India, Pune
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Hi Pathak,
It's sad that a few HR professionals have unethical practices. Under these circumstances, dropping a client is fair, but such incidents should be reported to higher officials to ensure it is stopped.
Thanks,
Nazneen
From India, Bangalore
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It's sad that a few HR professionals have unethical practices. Under these circumstances, dropping a client is fair, but such incidents should be reported to higher officials to ensure it is stopped.
Thanks,
Nazneen
From India, Bangalore
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Capt. Pathak,
It's the fate of the day seen everywhere in India. In fact, I have a few friends who threw their resignation in the face of the HR Managers and walked out when they were pressured to do unethical practices. India is a country where everyone wears a crown, the Crown of Madness and Aggressiveness. Look at the politicians who interfere with everything everywhere. They feel that they are great. They talk and preach, but when practice comes, they do just the opposite of what they say. For example, CPIM is a political party that had some ethics earlier. Now, you are probably reading from the news that the partymen have become corrupt to the core.
Even in temples, you will find that one has to bribe to go to the deity. This is the sad situation in India. From Kerala to Kashmir and from west to east. Sorry that we are Indians. Probably, the only politician who ever stood in the queue for renewing his driving license in an RTO office is our present Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh. Who else stood like that so far? RTO would have been called to the residence or office by any other politician.
What I want to state is the pathetic unethical behavior and actions of our top officials in organizations. I feel that they have to be given training in 'discipline and ethical behavior' by someone.
Thanks for the opportunity given to write this posting.
Gopan
From India, Kochi
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It's the fate of the day seen everywhere in India. In fact, I have a few friends who threw their resignation in the face of the HR Managers and walked out when they were pressured to do unethical practices. India is a country where everyone wears a crown, the Crown of Madness and Aggressiveness. Look at the politicians who interfere with everything everywhere. They feel that they are great. They talk and preach, but when practice comes, they do just the opposite of what they say. For example, CPIM is a political party that had some ethics earlier. Now, you are probably reading from the news that the partymen have become corrupt to the core.
Even in temples, you will find that one has to bribe to go to the deity. This is the sad situation in India. From Kerala to Kashmir and from west to east. Sorry that we are Indians. Probably, the only politician who ever stood in the queue for renewing his driving license in an RTO office is our present Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh. Who else stood like that so far? RTO would have been called to the residence or office by any other politician.
What I want to state is the pathetic unethical behavior and actions of our top officials in organizations. I feel that they have to be given training in 'discipline and ethical behavior' by someone.
Thanks for the opportunity given to write this posting.
Gopan
From India, Kochi
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Capt. Pathak,
I had posted a long comment, but it is not seen uploaded here. I was talking about the politicians and the leading bureaucracy, who are all corrupt to the core. This permeates everywhere, and we cannot escape it. Many have submitted their resignation letters to the CEO's face, walked out, and even yelled during the exit interview. This will not be set right unless India returns to the Britishers' era, where at least discipline was maintained.
Gopan
From India, Kochi
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I had posted a long comment, but it is not seen uploaded here. I was talking about the politicians and the leading bureaucracy, who are all corrupt to the core. This permeates everywhere, and we cannot escape it. Many have submitted their resignation letters to the CEO's face, walked out, and even yelled during the exit interview. This will not be set right unless India returns to the Britishers' era, where at least discipline was maintained.
Gopan
From India, Kochi
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Hi,
So true, yaar. These people are thinking that we are all fools. They are building their own database from the profiles that we send them. Utterly selfish people out there. We should stop sending profiles if we don't get feedback. And we should send the next set of profiles only if we receive feedback for the ones sent earlier. We all should teach them a lesson. I am sick of their behavior.
From India, Madras
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So true, yaar. These people are thinking that we are all fools. They are building their own database from the profiles that we send them. Utterly selfish people out there. We should stop sending profiles if we don't get feedback. And we should send the next set of profiles only if we receive feedback for the ones sent earlier. We all should teach them a lesson. I am sick of their behavior.
From India, Madras
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Dear Gopan,
You are right. And you know what? Thank God that we are not politicians! Thank God that we don't have to sell our souls for our greed! Thank God that we are ordinary people who have the freedom to choose and be responsible for our actions! Thank God that as HR professionals, the onus is on us to lead the way and bring ethics and integrity back in corporate governance! Thank God for giving us this chance to be honest and incorruptible!
And finally, thank God I don't own half of Hyderabad and have properties in 63 countries! Thank God I am not in jail! Thank God I am not greedy!
Capt. Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments and HR Solutions)
[LinkedIn Profile](http://www.linkedin.com/in/chandpathak)
[Creative Indians Website](http://www.creativeindians.com/)
Kind regards,
[Your Name]
From India, Lucknow
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You are right. And you know what? Thank God that we are not politicians! Thank God that we don't have to sell our souls for our greed! Thank God that we are ordinary people who have the freedom to choose and be responsible for our actions! Thank God that as HR professionals, the onus is on us to lead the way and bring ethics and integrity back in corporate governance! Thank God for giving us this chance to be honest and incorruptible!
And finally, thank God I don't own half of Hyderabad and have properties in 63 countries! Thank God I am not in jail! Thank God I am not greedy!
Capt. Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments and HR Solutions)
[LinkedIn Profile](http://www.linkedin.com/in/chandpathak)
[Creative Indians Website](http://www.creativeindians.com/)
Kind regards,
[Your Name]
From India, Lucknow
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Hello Friends,
First of all, I thank Chand Pathak for bringing up this extremely important topic for discussion in this forum. I hope this topic reaches all consulting professionals and "Corporate HRs."
My Experience:
I really agree with the points made by all the fellow members. Some of the "Corporate HRs" think that they are the only great people on this planet. The rest of the consulting firm guys are considered idiots! (Sorry to use this word, but this is how we feel while interacting with these "Corporate HRs"). Somebody rightly mentioned that they even forget that their prior exposure was in a consulting firm. I am also working in a consulting firm and facing exactly the same problems mentioned by Chand Pathak. I understand that the market conditions are bad/worst, etc., but that doesn't mean these HR professionals should fool around with us. We are also in the ethical business and profession. I think it should be a mutually beneficial relationship rather than wasting each other's precious time.
Solution:
I believe HR should consider themselves as just HR of any company and not as GOD/President or Prime Minister. Keep APJ Abdul Kalam as your idol. He is a great human being for India. Have any of the HR professionals ever seen that he carries the attitude they do? There is a long way to go in life and many more good things to do rather than playing cheap politics and behaving unprofessionally. "Committing yourself to continuous self-improvement" should be the motto of life rather than thinking "I am the BEST!!"
1. Nazeen has mentioned reporting to higher officials as the best way to handle these HR professionals. Try to get information on their reporting managers. This may make the HR professionals more careful in their behavior towards you.
2. We should be stricter when conversing with HR. Inform them that we have our own targets and plans.
3. Give them the confidence that we are the best to deliver. Make them realize this after delivering.
4. One practice we can adopt is sending them Achievement vs. Commitment emails every week. Highlight your achievements and non-achievements.
5. Give them the feeling that you are the best in the market, and they will automatically come to you. (After all, we are in a competitive world)
I really don't understand why they behave in such an unprofessional manner. In fact, we expect them to behave professionally and set the standard.
I am keen to know the reactions from the Corporate HRs.
Regards, Shruti
From India, Madras
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First of all, I thank Chand Pathak for bringing up this extremely important topic for discussion in this forum. I hope this topic reaches all consulting professionals and "Corporate HRs."
My Experience:
I really agree with the points made by all the fellow members. Some of the "Corporate HRs" think that they are the only great people on this planet. The rest of the consulting firm guys are considered idiots! (Sorry to use this word, but this is how we feel while interacting with these "Corporate HRs"). Somebody rightly mentioned that they even forget that their prior exposure was in a consulting firm. I am also working in a consulting firm and facing exactly the same problems mentioned by Chand Pathak. I understand that the market conditions are bad/worst, etc., but that doesn't mean these HR professionals should fool around with us. We are also in the ethical business and profession. I think it should be a mutually beneficial relationship rather than wasting each other's precious time.
Solution:
I believe HR should consider themselves as just HR of any company and not as GOD/President or Prime Minister. Keep APJ Abdul Kalam as your idol. He is a great human being for India. Have any of the HR professionals ever seen that he carries the attitude they do? There is a long way to go in life and many more good things to do rather than playing cheap politics and behaving unprofessionally. "Committing yourself to continuous self-improvement" should be the motto of life rather than thinking "I am the BEST!!"
1. Nazeen has mentioned reporting to higher officials as the best way to handle these HR professionals. Try to get information on their reporting managers. This may make the HR professionals more careful in their behavior towards you.
2. We should be stricter when conversing with HR. Inform them that we have our own targets and plans.
3. Give them the confidence that we are the best to deliver. Make them realize this after delivering.
4. One practice we can adopt is sending them Achievement vs. Commitment emails every week. Highlight your achievements and non-achievements.
5. Give them the feeling that you are the best in the market, and they will automatically come to you. (After all, we are in a competitive world)
I really don't understand why they behave in such an unprofessional manner. In fact, we expect them to behave professionally and set the standard.
I am keen to know the reactions from the Corporate HRs.
Regards, Shruti
From India, Madras
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Absolutely right, even my coworkers and I are facing such a problem. The major issue is that the HR staff are very rude; perhaps the CEO of that organization is much more generous than them.
Best course of action is to report to their Senior Manager or Head of HR in such a case and cease working for them immediately.
From India, Hyderabad
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Best course of action is to report to their Senior Manager or Head of HR in such a case and cease working for them immediately.
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Chandpathak,
I want to express my feelings on this. Many have quoted many things about INDIA & politicians, but we should not forget that those politicians are made by us only. How many of us voted wholeheartedly? How many of us do not consider caste or religion? How many of us are utilizing the most powerful weapon, "VOTE"? Due to the negligence of all of us, our country and our politicians are becoming corrupted. COME, LET'S VOTE FOR THE REAL LEADERS WHO CAN LEAD OUR INDIA TO HEIGHTS WHERE THESE DIRTY POLITICS AND CORRUPTION. I beg those who read this to utilize your right to vote. Join hands to build our Dream India.
Regards,
Jai
From India, Hyderabad
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I want to express my feelings on this. Many have quoted many things about INDIA & politicians, but we should not forget that those politicians are made by us only. How many of us voted wholeheartedly? How many of us do not consider caste or religion? How many of us are utilizing the most powerful weapon, "VOTE"? Due to the negligence of all of us, our country and our politicians are becoming corrupted. COME, LET'S VOTE FOR THE REAL LEADERS WHO CAN LEAD OUR INDIA TO HEIGHTS WHERE THESE DIRTY POLITICS AND CORRUPTION. I beg those who read this to utilize your right to vote. Join hands to build our Dream India.
Regards,
Jai
From India, Hyderabad
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Hi Chand,
What you have said is absolutely correct. I am one of the victims of this kind of issue. Can we email the same to the Head of HR instead of waiting for feedback from the local point of contact or local HR?
Monica
From India, Hyderabad
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What you have said is absolutely correct. I am one of the victims of this kind of issue. Can we email the same to the Head of HR instead of waiting for feedback from the local point of contact or local HR?
Monica
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Charishma,
Of course, we do that! Even if you have removed all the contact details, it is still very easy to fish out the profile from a portal or other sources. I can fish out the profile from the job portals, though it may be without any contact details in 1 min flat.
The question is, how can we allow some HR professionals (following unethical practices) to taint the entire HR community? How can we stop them from being unethical? We need to think hard and deep!
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient! (Recruitments & HR Solutions)
From India, Lucknow
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Of course, we do that! Even if you have removed all the contact details, it is still very easy to fish out the profile from a portal or other sources. I can fish out the profile from the job portals, though it may be without any contact details in 1 min flat.
The question is, how can we allow some HR professionals (following unethical practices) to taint the entire HR community? How can we stop them from being unethical? We need to think hard and deep!
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient! (Recruitments & HR Solutions)
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Pathak,
I totally agree with all your points. All we recruiters should also join hands against these HRs and should have a forum where we can openly discuss each other's problems and work out solutions.
Regards,
Shreya
From India, Calcutta
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I totally agree with all your points. All we recruiters should also join hands against these HRs and should have a forum where we can openly discuss each other's problems and work out solutions.
Regards,
Shreya
From India, Calcutta
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Dear Shreya,
The need is to find solutions to address the ethical issues in HR. Of course, an Association of recruiters will help, but we don't want a "US Vs Them" scenario. Consulting companies are very much a part of the HR community and not outside it.
This is something the Corporate HR needs to understand, and the consultants need to prove by being more professional and ethical.
The need is to embarrass the unethical managers and acclaim the good HR professionals from both Consulting companies and Corporate HR. There needs to be mutual respect and confidence.
We have to replace the term "Client is always right!" with "Client is always right till he behaves ethically!"
We can start an "Association of Ethical HR Practitioners." Let both the consulting companies, Recruiters, Corporate HR’s, Trainers, and all other HR practitioners who follow ethical practices be invited to join. We can discuss more details on this under a different thread I am creating.
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments & HR Solutions)
[LinkedIn Profile](http://www.linkedin.com/in/chandpathak)
From India, Lucknow
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The need is to find solutions to address the ethical issues in HR. Of course, an Association of recruiters will help, but we don't want a "US Vs Them" scenario. Consulting companies are very much a part of the HR community and not outside it.
This is something the Corporate HR needs to understand, and the consultants need to prove by being more professional and ethical.
The need is to embarrass the unethical managers and acclaim the good HR professionals from both Consulting companies and Corporate HR. There needs to be mutual respect and confidence.
We have to replace the term "Client is always right!" with "Client is always right till he behaves ethically!"
We can start an "Association of Ethical HR Practitioners." Let both the consulting companies, Recruiters, Corporate HR’s, Trainers, and all other HR practitioners who follow ethical practices be invited to join. We can discuss more details on this under a different thread I am creating.
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments & HR Solutions)
[LinkedIn Profile](http://www.linkedin.com/in/chandpathak)
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Friends,
Association of Ethical HR Practitioners.
Please do visit the following thread too: https://www.citehr.com/145451-association-ethical-hr-practitioners.html#post615294
There is a need to revive the belief in ethics in corporate governance in India. The HR community is well placed to acquire the role of becoming the "the Conscience" of the organization. Only that the HR professional will have to bring about the change - Starting with themselves. By being more ethical and professional.
We need to discuss and go about forming this association. All suggestions and discussion are welcome. Let's not limit it to any criteria like - Recruitment consulting companies, Recruiters, Corporate HR's, Trainers etc. All HR practitioners and thinkers who follow ethical practices should be invited to join.
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments & HR Solutions)
From India, Lucknow
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Association of Ethical HR Practitioners.
Please do visit the following thread too: https://www.citehr.com/145451-association-ethical-hr-practitioners.html#post615294
There is a need to revive the belief in ethics in corporate governance in India. The HR community is well placed to acquire the role of becoming the "the Conscience" of the organization. Only that the HR professional will have to bring about the change - Starting with themselves. By being more ethical and professional.
We need to discuss and go about forming this association. All suggestions and discussion are welcome. Let's not limit it to any criteria like - Recruitment consulting companies, Recruiters, Corporate HR's, Trainers etc. All HR practitioners and thinkers who follow ethical practices should be invited to join.
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments & HR Solutions)
From India, Lucknow
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We need anarchy. Only anarchy can save us. Anarchy means taking the law into your hands. So, if you find someone doing wrong, post their details here. We will all email about him/her to their top CEO. Today, it's only a matter of minutes to get the details of the CEO of any company. We need to outsmart them in their own game. Many times, HR professionals take money from recruiters for contracts, etc. This is equivalent to government employees. Nowadays, even government employees accept less money in bribes. These HR professionals bring shame to India. For such HR professionals who are on this site, your time will soon run out.
From India, Pune
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From India, Pune
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Hi Guys,
It's true, but we have to cope with the situation in a professional manner. Yes, we stopped working with clients whose feedback is not proper. However, what we are losing because of this practice is the goodwill of our company with the prospects. We don't know how to answer them in these situations and in turn lose the candidate for future requirements. The damage is more hurtful than the practice.
[IMG]https://www.citehr.com/misc.php?do=email_dev&email=a2tyYW50aGkyMDA3QG luZGlhdGltZXMuY29t[/IMG]
From India, Bangalore
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It's true, but we have to cope with the situation in a professional manner. Yes, we stopped working with clients whose feedback is not proper. However, what we are losing because of this practice is the goodwill of our company with the prospects. We don't know how to answer them in these situations and in turn lose the candidate for future requirements. The damage is more hurtful than the practice.
[IMG]https://www.citehr.com/misc.php?do=email_dev&email=a2tyYW50aGkyMDA3QG luZGlhdGltZXMuY29t[/IMG]
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Kranthi,
Our tolerant behavior will further encourage unethical professionals. Then there will be more who would find the courage to follow these practices (those who may have a moral dilemma but may jump the fence given an opportunity and an environment where their greed can flourish). Somebody needs to sacrifice. I don't expect others to follow ethical practices unless I refuse to pay bribes or refuse to deal and expose such people.
NO ONE has the RIGHT to eat into our hard work.
We must have some pride. Let us expose unethical HR professionals and unethical candidates. We can do it discreetly.
A username has been created by a group of ethical Indians at citehr.com. Their mission is to fight corruption and unethical practices at all levels, whether in government, public or private sectors, with juniors or seniors. Let their names, deeds, and organizations be exposed.
Username: unethical_indians
Password: vandematram
Give out in brief the unethical acts they committed, when, and where. There should be at least one or two more people who can vouch for the authenticity. Let there be no wrongful allegations just to hurt someone's reputation because of personal enmity.
We CAN remove corruption from India, and we WILL!
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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Our tolerant behavior will further encourage unethical professionals. Then there will be more who would find the courage to follow these practices (those who may have a moral dilemma but may jump the fence given an opportunity and an environment where their greed can flourish). Somebody needs to sacrifice. I don't expect others to follow ethical practices unless I refuse to pay bribes or refuse to deal and expose such people.
NO ONE has the RIGHT to eat into our hard work.
We must have some pride. Let us expose unethical HR professionals and unethical candidates. We can do it discreetly.
A username has been created by a group of ethical Indians at citehr.com. Their mission is to fight corruption and unethical practices at all levels, whether in government, public or private sectors, with juniors or seniors. Let their names, deeds, and organizations be exposed.
Username: unethical_indians
Password: vandematram
Give out in brief the unethical acts they committed, when, and where. There should be at least one or two more people who can vouch for the authenticity. Let there be no wrongful allegations just to hurt someone's reputation because of personal enmity.
We CAN remove corruption from India, and we WILL!
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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Well, guys, let's stop this politician bashing and let's evaluate ourselves first:
1. Buying pirated CDs/software for home/office.
2. Saving taxes by producing fake bills/house rents.
3. Sharing logins of portals.
How many of us feel the pain when we do this, but we justify it by giving some reasons. We know we are fooling ourselves. We are not bothered about the boiling cauldron or wrath of God when we do wrong as we always have some reason.
The reason is simple: we spoil the system and affect others, influencing them to do the same by bragging about our benefits achieved by doing something wrong. When it comes full circle and we get affected, we feel the pain, we feel the heat, and we start against politicians; we lambaste our system.
Guys, let's change ourselves, and only then will society change. Good and bad have a full circle; it comes back to the doer.
From India, Delhi
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1. Buying pirated CDs/software for home/office.
2. Saving taxes by producing fake bills/house rents.
3. Sharing logins of portals.
How many of us feel the pain when we do this, but we justify it by giving some reasons. We know we are fooling ourselves. We are not bothered about the boiling cauldron or wrath of God when we do wrong as we always have some reason.
The reason is simple: we spoil the system and affect others, influencing them to do the same by bragging about our benefits achieved by doing something wrong. When it comes full circle and we get affected, we feel the pain, we feel the heat, and we start against politicians; we lambaste our system.
Guys, let's change ourselves, and only then will society change. Good and bad have a full circle; it comes back to the doer.
From India, Delhi
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Well, guys, let's stop this politician bashing and let's evaluate ourselves first.
1. Buying pirated CDs/software for home/office.
2. Saving taxes by producing fake bills/house rents.
3. Sharing logins of portals.
How many of us feel the pain when we do this, but we justify it by giving some reasons. We know we are fooling ourselves; we are not bothered about the boiling cauldron or the wrath of God when we do wrong, as we always have some reason.
The reason is simple: we spoil the system and affect others, influencing them to do the same by bragging about our benefits achieved by doing something wrong. When it comes full circle and we get affected, we feel the pain, we feel the heat, and we start against politicians, we lambaste our system.
Guys, let's change ourselves, and then only society will change. Good and bad have a full circle; it comes back to the doer.
Let's start at a good point so that when the circle completes, we get something good.
I am in no way justifying the practices this column is against. That's wrong, and they sure will receive it back sooner or later.
From India, Delhi
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1. Buying pirated CDs/software for home/office.
2. Saving taxes by producing fake bills/house rents.
3. Sharing logins of portals.
How many of us feel the pain when we do this, but we justify it by giving some reasons. We know we are fooling ourselves; we are not bothered about the boiling cauldron or the wrath of God when we do wrong, as we always have some reason.
The reason is simple: we spoil the system and affect others, influencing them to do the same by bragging about our benefits achieved by doing something wrong. When it comes full circle and we get affected, we feel the pain, we feel the heat, and we start against politicians, we lambaste our system.
Guys, let's change ourselves, and then only society will change. Good and bad have a full circle; it comes back to the doer.
Let's start at a good point so that when the circle completes, we get something good.
I am in no way justifying the practices this column is against. That's wrong, and they sure will receive it back sooner or later.
From India, Delhi
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Dear Angelhr,
I think all good-meaning Indians would already be trying or at least giving it a thought. Your views strangely seem to be justifying the unethical practices. I am sure we can't change ourselves and our society overnight. But at least we can take one thing at a time and start trying! Let's take corruption. Can we take a vow never to give a bribe? Can we take a vow never to take a bribe? Can we try with an attempt to stop corruption? I am sure if we try - "Hole Hole khatam ho jayegi corruption...."
I am inspired by President Obama who owned his mistake and said: "I screwed up!" I take a vow today on the 12th of February 2009: I will never give or take a bribe in my life from now on! I wish to disclose that I am guilty of bribing a senior manager three times to keep my contract going. I have stopped that now. I may lose the contract. So be it. See Angelhr, I guess I just made a small beginning...
Capt Chand Pathak
From India, Delhi
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I think all good-meaning Indians would already be trying or at least giving it a thought. Your views strangely seem to be justifying the unethical practices. I am sure we can't change ourselves and our society overnight. But at least we can take one thing at a time and start trying! Let's take corruption. Can we take a vow never to give a bribe? Can we take a vow never to take a bribe? Can we try with an attempt to stop corruption? I am sure if we try - "Hole Hole khatam ho jayegi corruption...."
I am inspired by President Obama who owned his mistake and said: "I screwed up!" I take a vow today on the 12th of February 2009: I will never give or take a bribe in my life from now on! I wish to disclose that I am guilty of bribing a senior manager three times to keep my contract going. I have stopped that now. I may lose the contract. So be it. See Angelhr, I guess I just made a small beginning...
Capt Chand Pathak
From India, Delhi
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Dear All,
I worked for a consultancy for one year and am currently working for a corporation. I have experience in recruitment at both places. Trust me, consultants are very important and play a crucial role in hiring and meeting deadlines for corporate recruitment HR to survive.
Just prove to them (I mean whoever follows unethical practices) that you provide quality work and will not entertain corrupt means. Corruption only starts if you comply with their demands. Think about it, guys.
Thanks,
Nazneen
From India, Bangalore
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I worked for a consultancy for one year and am currently working for a corporation. I have experience in recruitment at both places. Trust me, consultants are very important and play a crucial role in hiring and meeting deadlines for corporate recruitment HR to survive.
Just prove to them (I mean whoever follows unethical practices) that you provide quality work and will not entertain corrupt means. Corruption only starts if you comply with their demands. Think about it, guys.
Thanks,
Nazneen
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Chand,
Great work done, thanks for at least taking an initiative. Apart from Nazeen and Angel, I don't think any HR has been bothered to reply or comment on the issue. Nazeen, I really agree with your comments and thanks for that. Now the issue has turned to politics and against corruption. Let me tell you that these corporates are least bothered about these things because they are earning too much and enjoying it, with no concern for society. Just take the Mumbai attack; no one took at least a minute for a condolence or a single post...
From India, Bangalore
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Great work done, thanks for at least taking an initiative. Apart from Nazeen and Angel, I don't think any HR has been bothered to reply or comment on the issue. Nazeen, I really agree with your comments and thanks for that. Now the issue has turned to politics and against corruption. Let me tell you that these corporates are least bothered about these things because they are earning too much and enjoying it, with no concern for society. Just take the Mumbai attack; no one took at least a minute for a condolence or a single post...
From India, Bangalore
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Dear Mr. Pathak,
You are right from your side. If the client does not respond, then you can stop sending CVs for openings. As an HR person, you are also helpless when the management of the company does not provide an answer. So, while doing tie-ups, check everything and make a condition that if feedback is not provided, then we will not send a CV for your openings.
Most of you may coordinate with the HR Executive or Manager of the company, but also take the email ID of that person's immediate boss and keep him in the CC. If you do not get a reply, then you can directly send an email regarding that to his immediate boss. You are putting in a lot of effort to search for the right candidate, so in order to make the employer aware, you can do this.
Regards,
Tejas Thakker:p
From India, Ahmadabad
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You are right from your side. If the client does not respond, then you can stop sending CVs for openings. As an HR person, you are also helpless when the management of the company does not provide an answer. So, while doing tie-ups, check everything and make a condition that if feedback is not provided, then we will not send a CV for your openings.
Most of you may coordinate with the HR Executive or Manager of the company, but also take the email ID of that person's immediate boss and keep him in the CC. If you do not get a reply, then you can directly send an email regarding that to his immediate boss. You are putting in a lot of effort to search for the right candidate, so in order to make the employer aware, you can do this.
Regards,
Tejas Thakker:p
From India, Ahmadabad
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Dear Ms.Nazreen could you send me any material on attrition like how to calculate attrition etc Regards, Tejas Thakker :icon1:
From India, Ahmadabad
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From India, Ahmadabad
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Caption:
I completely agree with what you say because initially, at the beginning of my career, I worked in a consultancy. I still remember that I had a client who called me at 6.30/7.00 pm, stating that his system admin had left the organization without giving any notice. He asked me to send the profiles IMMEDIATELY. That evening, I practically worked late into the night, scheduled the candidates for him, conducted interviews, and one candidate was selected. After that, I constantly called him for the further process, but he gave me excuses and made up answers. Then, one fine day, he informed me that they had put the hiring process on HOLD.
So yes, I have also encountered exactly the same situation.
Vrocks
From India, Pune
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I completely agree with what you say because initially, at the beginning of my career, I worked in a consultancy. I still remember that I had a client who called me at 6.30/7.00 pm, stating that his system admin had left the organization without giving any notice. He asked me to send the profiles IMMEDIATELY. That evening, I practically worked late into the night, scheduled the candidates for him, conducted interviews, and one candidate was selected. After that, I constantly called him for the further process, but he gave me excuses and made up answers. Then, one fine day, he informed me that they had put the hiring process on HOLD.
So yes, I have also encountered exactly the same situation.
Vrocks
From India, Pune
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Hello All,
I am really happy with the point made by Nazneen: "I did recruitment in both places, trust me consultants are very important and play a crucial role in hiring and meeting deadlines for corporate recruitment HR in order to survive." She is really a good human being. I think the rest of the few HRs who exploit consultants should at least learn the quality of appreciation from her and learn from her how to respect other people in the professional world.
I think as this topic is in this forum for discussion why it's been ignored by the rest of HRs. I am very sure many of the HRs in this forum might be working in Corporate Staffing/Recruitments, etc.
Kindly let us know what problem you face that you start disrespecting/ignoring the consultancy guys? :-x We have many respected and experienced seniors in this forum; they will definitely help you out to get the solution to your problems. As every problem has a solution! :icon1:
Regards,
Shruti
From India, Madras
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I am really happy with the point made by Nazneen: "I did recruitment in both places, trust me consultants are very important and play a crucial role in hiring and meeting deadlines for corporate recruitment HR in order to survive." She is really a good human being. I think the rest of the few HRs who exploit consultants should at least learn the quality of appreciation from her and learn from her how to respect other people in the professional world.
I think as this topic is in this forum for discussion why it's been ignored by the rest of HRs. I am very sure many of the HRs in this forum might be working in Corporate Staffing/Recruitments, etc.
Kindly let us know what problem you face that you start disrespecting/ignoring the consultancy guys? :-x We have many respected and experienced seniors in this forum; they will definitely help you out to get the solution to your problems. As every problem has a solution! :icon1:
Regards,
Shruti
From India, Madras
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Dear Tejas,
Firstly, there are only a few black sheep. I have known some fantastic HR Managers and executives with exemplary conduct and professionalism. It was a pleasure and a learning experience working with them, and it still is.
Personally, I would like to trust the people I am working with and try to avoid showing any suspicion of unfair practice. I wouldn't like to report to their senior either because I am not sure if that works. I have tried that and discovered that seniors turn a blind eye. They may be more concerned about being able to answer to their superiors rather than favoring an outside consultant by holding their own staff accountable.
I am not sure. I want to believe this. Please tell me if seniors view juniors as unethical if they follow unethical practices and if they will take action if we report it.
Finally, I am not willing at all to point out anyone or find faults. I am struggling to correct my own shortcomings as a person and as a professional. I really don't have the time or inclination to correct others.
But how long can we keep quiet and tolerate unprofessional behavior by some of these people? At whose cost? At whose inconvenience? Whose hard work goes to waste? Who does not get paid? Who fails to earn their monthly incentives?
Are those people working hard as recruiters with a consultant not humans? Don't they deserve recognition for their hard work? The hard work of others comes cheaply to these people.
We just need to STOP tolerating unethical behavior.
From India, Lucknow
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Firstly, there are only a few black sheep. I have known some fantastic HR Managers and executives with exemplary conduct and professionalism. It was a pleasure and a learning experience working with them, and it still is.
Personally, I would like to trust the people I am working with and try to avoid showing any suspicion of unfair practice. I wouldn't like to report to their senior either because I am not sure if that works. I have tried that and discovered that seniors turn a blind eye. They may be more concerned about being able to answer to their superiors rather than favoring an outside consultant by holding their own staff accountable.
I am not sure. I want to believe this. Please tell me if seniors view juniors as unethical if they follow unethical practices and if they will take action if we report it.
Finally, I am not willing at all to point out anyone or find faults. I am struggling to correct my own shortcomings as a person and as a professional. I really don't have the time or inclination to correct others.
But how long can we keep quiet and tolerate unprofessional behavior by some of these people? At whose cost? At whose inconvenience? Whose hard work goes to waste? Who does not get paid? Who fails to earn their monthly incentives?
Are those people working hard as recruiters with a consultant not humans? Don't they deserve recognition for their hard work? The hard work of others comes cheaply to these people.
We just need to STOP tolerating unethical behavior.
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Capt,
These are absolutely true. As I am working as a recruitment consultant in an executive search firm, I also face the same problems. Most of the time, HR does not provide the correct requirements and feedback. Most of the time, the requirements will be so urgent that after sending the profiles, there won't be any feedback. It is very difficult to get an appointment with these people or even to talk on the phone. They are always busy. Are they really so busy? The corporate HR people should understand that it is for their benefit that these consultants work. Even though the consultants will get a commission, the company will benefit in the long term by utilizing the knowledge and skill of the candidates.
Regards,
Mithun
From India, Mumbai
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These are absolutely true. As I am working as a recruitment consultant in an executive search firm, I also face the same problems. Most of the time, HR does not provide the correct requirements and feedback. Most of the time, the requirements will be so urgent that after sending the profiles, there won't be any feedback. It is very difficult to get an appointment with these people or even to talk on the phone. They are always busy. Are they really so busy? The corporate HR people should understand that it is for their benefit that these consultants work. Even though the consultants will get a commission, the company will benefit in the long term by utilizing the knowledge and skill of the candidates.
Regards,
Mithun
From India, Mumbai
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Hi,
It's true, but you don't understand the pains of HR in a corporate setting. The corporate management will not give complete information and ask the HR team to complete the work. There may be a plan for recruitment; however, even though the managers and directors know that someone is leaving the company and they need to replace or create a new position, they don't bother to inform HR in advance. They inform at the last minute and say it's an urgent position that needs to be filled. After consulting with a consultancy and obtaining enough profiles, they don't provide feedback, and eventually, a reference candidate will be selected. People often perceive HR in a company as the backbone, but in reality, HR has become just a figurehead in the corporate world. They are expected to simply follow the instructions of the directors and get blamed if anything goes wrong. Employees openly express to HR that they are ineffective in the organization.
Companies hire HR professionals only to be blamed.
"It's KALYUG, and these things are bound to happen. All HR have become arrogant with their power; they will soon face consequences. Don't worry, as you sow, so shall you reap."
Thank you.
From India, Hyderabad
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It's true, but you don't understand the pains of HR in a corporate setting. The corporate management will not give complete information and ask the HR team to complete the work. There may be a plan for recruitment; however, even though the managers and directors know that someone is leaving the company and they need to replace or create a new position, they don't bother to inform HR in advance. They inform at the last minute and say it's an urgent position that needs to be filled. After consulting with a consultancy and obtaining enough profiles, they don't provide feedback, and eventually, a reference candidate will be selected. People often perceive HR in a company as the backbone, but in reality, HR has become just a figurehead in the corporate world. They are expected to simply follow the instructions of the directors and get blamed if anything goes wrong. Employees openly express to HR that they are ineffective in the organization.
Companies hire HR professionals only to be blamed.
"It's KALYUG, and these things are bound to happen. All HR have become arrogant with their power; they will soon face consequences. Don't worry, as you sow, so shall you reap."
Thank you.
From India, Hyderabad
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Hi, you are right. But HR people are also poor in this situation because firstly, the department forces them to recruit, and suddenly they are told someone else is appointed. One thing always remember is that HR personnel cannot do a consultant's work. You have a lot of power, so give them tit for tat.
Varsha
From India, Faridabad
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Varsha
From India, Faridabad
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Dear Usha,
I must applaud your willingness to come out with the corporate HR's point of view. Thank you for contributing your thoughts.
Yes, these kinds of things happen, but I presume you can be proactive and impress upon your seniors during team meetings the necessity to plan the hiring and keep the HR in the loop at various developments.
Moreover, I feel any HR worth his salt can smell out things about people. You need to be talking to everyone in the organization, keep the senior line managers in good humor, gain everybody's confidence. You are a pro at dealing with the human psyche. I am sure you can also rely on the grapevine to an extent in situations you mentioned.
More importantly, throw your weight with management, don't be a pushover. You represent the HR community in your organization. People run organizations, not computers. And YOU are the people expert in the Company. Let everybody know that!
Best of luck.
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments & HR Solutions)
[LinkedIn: Capt Chand Pathak]
From India, Lucknow
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I must applaud your willingness to come out with the corporate HR's point of view. Thank you for contributing your thoughts.
Yes, these kinds of things happen, but I presume you can be proactive and impress upon your seniors during team meetings the necessity to plan the hiring and keep the HR in the loop at various developments.
Moreover, I feel any HR worth his salt can smell out things about people. You need to be talking to everyone in the organization, keep the senior line managers in good humor, gain everybody's confidence. You are a pro at dealing with the human psyche. I am sure you can also rely on the grapevine to an extent in situations you mentioned.
More importantly, throw your weight with management, don't be a pushover. You represent the HR community in your organization. People run organizations, not computers. And YOU are the people expert in the Company. Let everybody know that!
Best of luck.
Capt Chand Pathak
Chief Operating Officer
Creative Indians - Incredibly Efficient!
(Recruitments & HR Solutions)
[LinkedIn: Capt Chand Pathak]
From India, Lucknow
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My Dear Chand Pathak,
Someone created a blog to highlight unethical HR practices. I hope this will definitely help you.
blacklistcandidates.blogspot.com
You can forward the same.
Regards,
Durga Gangadhar
From India, Hyderabad
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Someone created a blog to highlight unethical HR practices. I hope this will definitely help you.
blacklistcandidates.blogspot.com
You can forward the same.
Regards,
Durga Gangadhar
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Sir,
You are correct. I have faced this day in and day out in recruitments. It is not only profiles, payments, new proposals, coming to the phone, picking up the phone, replying to emails, reverting to SMSs, and all other attempts to speak to them.
I have interacted with recruiters in various sectors and found this practice very common in IT and ITES. In case they think that we are at their mercy, then their thoughts need to change at the earliest.
In my opinion, all the recruitment agencies and consulting firms need to come together at a single platform and decide whether they would like to work with such recruiters and organizations or not. If needed, ERA should intervene.
I do understand that there is a bad fish in every pond. Every recruiter needs respect and recognition for the hard work they do. It is simply insulting to ignore anyone or try to fool others.
Thank you.
Mayank Chaturvedi
9999099951
From India, Delhi
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You are correct. I have faced this day in and day out in recruitments. It is not only profiles, payments, new proposals, coming to the phone, picking up the phone, replying to emails, reverting to SMSs, and all other attempts to speak to them.
I have interacted with recruiters in various sectors and found this practice very common in IT and ITES. In case they think that we are at their mercy, then their thoughts need to change at the earliest.
In my opinion, all the recruitment agencies and consulting firms need to come together at a single platform and decide whether they would like to work with such recruiters and organizations or not. If needed, ERA should intervene.
I do understand that there is a bad fish in every pond. Every recruiter needs respect and recognition for the hard work they do. It is simply insulting to ignore anyone or try to fool others.
Thank you.
Mayank Chaturvedi
9999099951
From India, Delhi
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First and foremost, let me appreciate your views. We must wait for when most people will realize and pay attention to the consultants. A blog created by someone from the HR Consulting community for expressing concerns and pain points like this. Please visit; it may be helpful for you.
blacklistcandidates.blogspot.com
From India, Hyderabad
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blacklistcandidates.blogspot.com
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Durga,
Thanks for the link to the blogspot. It can prove very useful, but I think we need to create a group actually where names and details of these candidates are circulated to all the group members on a daily basis. I feel the numbers on the blog are too few. We ourselves may have around 25-30 candidates that we have internally blacklisted. Imagine the accumulated number of 1000 consultants across India!!!
Best wishes
From India, Lucknow
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Thanks for the link to the blogspot. It can prove very useful, but I think we need to create a group actually where names and details of these candidates are circulated to all the group members on a daily basis. I feel the numbers on the blog are too few. We ourselves may have around 25-30 candidates that we have internally blacklisted. Imagine the accumulated number of 1000 consultants across India!!!
Best wishes
From India, Lucknow
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Currently, I am working as an HR Manager in an IT company for the last year. However, I want to transition to a larger company in a different industry. Could you please assist me with this?
Thanks & Regards,
RAM NAIK
E-Mail ID: ramnaikd@gmail.com
From India, Hyderabad
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Thanks & Regards,
RAM NAIK
E-Mail ID: ramnaikd@gmail.com
From India, Hyderabad
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Hi Capt Pathak,
There is a need to awaken the overall conscience of the HR Managers.
I myself worked in a corporate HR in a BPO company, and I must admit that unethical practices are openly followed in the HR departments of BPO and IT companies. Individual greed takes precedence over conscience, leading to the following of unethical practices by the HR professionals. If someone does not follow these unethical practices, they are treated as outcasts not only by their colleagues but also by their managers. They try to get rid of them by framing them in some controversy or the other.
In the BPO company, I was handling the reference checks of the employees who have been selected. My job was to call the employees' previous managers and inquire about the background of the selected candidate. Sometimes, I have found that the candidate had performed very poorly in their previous organization and was asked to leave. Some employees even had a criminal background in the past. However, I was forced by my HR Manager not to report or disclose it, and that person was still taken on-board.
The main reason behind this (as I came to know later on) was that the HR manager had been promised some share of the commission to be given to the consultant. The employee needs to stay in the company for three months before the amount is disbursed by the company, only then can the HR Manager claim his share of the commission from the consultant.
In many ways, employees were taken on board despite having a dubious past track record. I also could not speak out for fear of losing my job. If I were to go against my manager and report his wrongdoings to the Vice President (HR), who is close to the VP, he would frame me with some trumped-up charges and have me terminated instead.
Hence, my suggestion would be that the consultant should be ethical from their side and conduct a proper background check before sending the candidate to the client.
Consultant firms should form an association or union of their own and get it registered by the government. They should lobby for their rights and voice their grievances through these registered associations. As rightly said before, they need to sever ties with companies that follow such unethical practices. They should do so in an organized manner through their associations, asking all the member firms in the association not to provide any manpower to any corporate firm that follows such unethical practices.
Regards,
Debashish Pal
From India, Delhi
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There is a need to awaken the overall conscience of the HR Managers.
I myself worked in a corporate HR in a BPO company, and I must admit that unethical practices are openly followed in the HR departments of BPO and IT companies. Individual greed takes precedence over conscience, leading to the following of unethical practices by the HR professionals. If someone does not follow these unethical practices, they are treated as outcasts not only by their colleagues but also by their managers. They try to get rid of them by framing them in some controversy or the other.
In the BPO company, I was handling the reference checks of the employees who have been selected. My job was to call the employees' previous managers and inquire about the background of the selected candidate. Sometimes, I have found that the candidate had performed very poorly in their previous organization and was asked to leave. Some employees even had a criminal background in the past. However, I was forced by my HR Manager not to report or disclose it, and that person was still taken on-board.
The main reason behind this (as I came to know later on) was that the HR manager had been promised some share of the commission to be given to the consultant. The employee needs to stay in the company for three months before the amount is disbursed by the company, only then can the HR Manager claim his share of the commission from the consultant.
In many ways, employees were taken on board despite having a dubious past track record. I also could not speak out for fear of losing my job. If I were to go against my manager and report his wrongdoings to the Vice President (HR), who is close to the VP, he would frame me with some trumped-up charges and have me terminated instead.
Hence, my suggestion would be that the consultant should be ethical from their side and conduct a proper background check before sending the candidate to the client.
Consultant firms should form an association or union of their own and get it registered by the government. They should lobby for their rights and voice their grievances through these registered associations. As rightly said before, they need to sever ties with companies that follow such unethical practices. They should do so in an organized manner through their associations, asking all the member firms in the association not to provide any manpower to any corporate firm that follows such unethical practices.
Regards,
Debashish Pal
From India, Delhi
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Capt. Pathak, Please do not blame the entire community for just a few black sheeps. Also, I am pained to see the way many have responded. We should not generalise the episode.. Regards, Hari
From India, Thiruvananthapuram
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From India, Thiruvananthapuram
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I agree with all of your points and with utmost respect to everyone's comments, I would like to make the following points.
1. It was commented that the HRs in MNC collect the required database and state that the requirement is closed. But where is this database collected from, Naukri and Monster... Don't you think that these MNCs have their own logins? On the other hand, could it be true that the openings have really been frozen...?
2. It is simple... if you want to work in this field with big MNCs amidst a sea of competitors, it's better to put on a thinking cap and consider other facets of HR functions. Because, as it stands, recruitment consultancy is the easiest of them all.
3. I come from a consultancy background myself, but a fresher may not see it as a career path; instead, they might view it as an easy entry into the corporate world. Do you think such an individual would need the help of a recruiting consultancy?
4. I appreciate recruitment consultancies for providing jobs to freshers (paying peanuts' shells), sometimes even less than what a person in a call center earns... Where do ethics come into the picture now...?
In my opinion, this is a wasteful investment that any company would make with such unethical consultants.
From India, Pune
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1. It was commented that the HRs in MNC collect the required database and state that the requirement is closed. But where is this database collected from, Naukri and Monster... Don't you think that these MNCs have their own logins? On the other hand, could it be true that the openings have really been frozen...?
2. It is simple... if you want to work in this field with big MNCs amidst a sea of competitors, it's better to put on a thinking cap and consider other facets of HR functions. Because, as it stands, recruitment consultancy is the easiest of them all.
3. I come from a consultancy background myself, but a fresher may not see it as a career path; instead, they might view it as an easy entry into the corporate world. Do you think such an individual would need the help of a recruiting consultancy?
4. I appreciate recruitment consultancies for providing jobs to freshers (paying peanuts' shells), sometimes even less than what a person in a call center earns... Where do ethics come into the picture now...?
In my opinion, this is a wasteful investment that any company would make with such unethical consultants.
From India, Pune
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Dear Mr. Hari,
If you read carefully, everybody has somebody to complain about. That becomes a lot of them out there, and we cannot ignore this.
Also, I have mentioned outstanding HR professionals who are a pleasure to work with and that there are some who follow unethical practices. Some recruitment consultants, trainers, and other HR professionals may also be following unethical practices, but we'll save that discussion for another day.
Also, I myself am part of the HR community, and I think recruitment consultants, recruiters, trainers, OD consultants, etc., who are taking part in the hiring process and other HR functions from the inside or outside are as well.
We are not outside the HR community of India unless you consider only those who are permanently employed with corporates.
You can take this as a longstanding and suppressed outpour of problems within the HR community, which involves corporate HR, recruitment, and hiring practices, nothing more.
All I am hoping is that something good comes out of this outpour of a discussion and that no one's feelings are hurt!
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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If you read carefully, everybody has somebody to complain about. That becomes a lot of them out there, and we cannot ignore this.
Also, I have mentioned outstanding HR professionals who are a pleasure to work with and that there are some who follow unethical practices. Some recruitment consultants, trainers, and other HR professionals may also be following unethical practices, but we'll save that discussion for another day.
Also, I myself am part of the HR community, and I think recruitment consultants, recruiters, trainers, OD consultants, etc., who are taking part in the hiring process and other HR functions from the inside or outside are as well.
We are not outside the HR community of India unless you consider only those who are permanently employed with corporates.
You can take this as a longstanding and suppressed outpour of problems within the HR community, which involves corporate HR, recruitment, and hiring practices, nothing more.
All I am hoping is that something good comes out of this outpour of a discussion and that no one's feelings are hurt!
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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Yes, Mr. Captn, I do agree with this point. The firm I work for and I had three such experiences in the last two months. Out of these, two clients are among India's top, rather leading companies in the Manufacturing sector. We were sourcing for the Top Management. But lost as to what to do about it?
Regards,
Priya V
From India, Madras
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Regards,
Priya V
From India, Madras
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Hello Friends,
It's really surprising that 1,486 people have viewed this post and hardly less than 50 professionals have replied to it. I think this is one of the most important issues to be discussed.
Let me tell you in my company many of my colleagues are facing the same problem from the Corporate Recruiters / Staffing Specialists in corporate.
1. Not picking up calls
2. Asking the candidates to schedule and reschedule again and again. (That too Senior Candidates)
3. Showing as if only they are the only people who have work, rest of the Consultancies guys are sitting idle and useless.
4. If they don't have any requirements, why unnecessarily share the requirements with consultants? Inform us that it's very urgent!
5. If they are internally closing the position shared with the consultants, then some of the HR doesn't even have the courtesy to inform the consultants to stop working on it.
6. We will burn the midnight oil to get the best of the best talent in the market (The guys who are not absolutely on any job portals). But they really don't care about it!
Why don't these people understand that we have not signed a contract for TIME PASS? We really want to serve and do business, so we have signed it. We are also here to earn our bread and butter and complete our responsibilities properly.
I really don't know, but this year 2008 and 2009 are really bad for me. I am really working with the worst HR's on this earth. They are so bad that the Directors/Technical managers are completing the HR responsibilities of aligning interviews and the rest of the activities. Managers are more good and humble than these HRs.
I really miss 2006 and 2007 in which I have really worked with the best HR's on this earth. I really miss them a lot. Hope I get a chance to work with them again.
And now my situation is enough is enough... and the patience is really over... I don't understand how to tackle these extra-smart Staffing Specialists in corporate.
Regards,
Shruti
From India, Madras
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It's really surprising that 1,486 people have viewed this post and hardly less than 50 professionals have replied to it. I think this is one of the most important issues to be discussed.
Let me tell you in my company many of my colleagues are facing the same problem from the Corporate Recruiters / Staffing Specialists in corporate.
1. Not picking up calls
2. Asking the candidates to schedule and reschedule again and again. (That too Senior Candidates)
3. Showing as if only they are the only people who have work, rest of the Consultancies guys are sitting idle and useless.
4. If they don't have any requirements, why unnecessarily share the requirements with consultants? Inform us that it's very urgent!
5. If they are internally closing the position shared with the consultants, then some of the HR doesn't even have the courtesy to inform the consultants to stop working on it.
6. We will burn the midnight oil to get the best of the best talent in the market (The guys who are not absolutely on any job portals). But they really don't care about it!
Why don't these people understand that we have not signed a contract for TIME PASS? We really want to serve and do business, so we have signed it. We are also here to earn our bread and butter and complete our responsibilities properly.
I really don't know, but this year 2008 and 2009 are really bad for me. I am really working with the worst HR's on this earth. They are so bad that the Directors/Technical managers are completing the HR responsibilities of aligning interviews and the rest of the activities. Managers are more good and humble than these HRs.
I really miss 2006 and 2007 in which I have really worked with the best HR's on this earth. I really miss them a lot. Hope I get a chance to work with them again.
And now my situation is enough is enough... and the patience is really over... I don't understand how to tackle these extra-smart Staffing Specialists in corporate.
Regards,
Shruti
From India, Madras
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
Hello Friends,
It’s really surprising that 1,486 people have viewed this post and hardly less than 50 professional have replied to it.
I think this is one of the most important issue to be discussed.
Let me tell you in my company many of my colleagues are facing the same problem from the Corporate Recruiters / Staffing Specialist in corporate.
1. Not picking up calls
2. Asking the candidates to schedule and reschedule again and again. (That too Senior Candidates)
3. Showing as if only they are the only people has work rest of the Consultancies guys are sitting ideal and useless.
4. If they don’t have any requirements why unnecessarily they share the requirements with consultants. Inform us that it’s very urgent!!!!!!
5. If they are internally closing the position shared with the consultants then some of the HR doesn’t even have courtesy to inform the consultants to stop working on it.
6. We will burn the mid night oil to get best of best talent in market (The guys who are not absolutely in any job portals). But they really don’t care about it!!
Why these people doesn’t understand that we have not signed a contract for
TIME PASS. We really want to serve and do business so we have signed it.
We are also her to earn our bread and butter and complete our responsibilities properly.
I really don’t know but this year 2008 and 2009 is really bad for me.
I am really working with the worst HR’s on this earth. They are so bad that the Director/Technical managers are completing the HR responsibilities of aligning interviews and rest of activities. Mangers are more good and humble than these HRs.
I really miss 2006 and 20007 in which I have really worked with
the best HR’s on this earth. I really miss them a lot. Hope I get a chance to work with them again.
And now my situation is enough is enough…and the patience is really over…..
I don’t understand how to tackle these extra smart Staffing Specialist in corporate.
Regards,
Shruti
From India, Madras
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
It’s really surprising that 1,486 people have viewed this post and hardly less than 50 professional have replied to it.
I think this is one of the most important issue to be discussed.
Let me tell you in my company many of my colleagues are facing the same problem from the Corporate Recruiters / Staffing Specialist in corporate.
1. Not picking up calls
2. Asking the candidates to schedule and reschedule again and again. (That too Senior Candidates)
3. Showing as if only they are the only people has work rest of the Consultancies guys are sitting ideal and useless.
4. If they don’t have any requirements why unnecessarily they share the requirements with consultants. Inform us that it’s very urgent!!!!!!
5. If they are internally closing the position shared with the consultants then some of the HR doesn’t even have courtesy to inform the consultants to stop working on it.
6. We will burn the mid night oil to get best of best talent in market (The guys who are not absolutely in any job portals). But they really don’t care about it!!
Why these people doesn’t understand that we have not signed a contract for
TIME PASS. We really want to serve and do business so we have signed it.
We are also her to earn our bread and butter and complete our responsibilities properly.
I really don’t know but this year 2008 and 2009 is really bad for me.
I am really working with the worst HR’s on this earth. They are so bad that the Director/Technical managers are completing the HR responsibilities of aligning interviews and rest of activities. Mangers are more good and humble than these HRs.
I really miss 2006 and 20007 in which I have really worked with
the best HR’s on this earth. I really miss them a lot. Hope I get a chance to work with them again.
And now my situation is enough is enough…and the patience is really over…..
I don’t understand how to tackle these extra smart Staffing Specialist in corporate.
Regards,
Shruti
From India, Madras
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Dear Shruti,
I understand why you are so upset. I feel that the young recruiters working with consultants have the biggest heart amongst professionals. Recruitment requires a lot of skill and people expertise, as well as hard work and competence.
Maybe the HR professionals in some corporates are actually just incompetent. Some may be both unethical and incompetent. The recruiters have no choice but to grin and bear their incompetence.
The time has come for the consultants to take over all the HR functions in corporates and not just recruitments.
Capt. Chand Pathak
Creative Indians
From India, Lucknow
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I understand why you are so upset. I feel that the young recruiters working with consultants have the biggest heart amongst professionals. Recruitment requires a lot of skill and people expertise, as well as hard work and competence.
Maybe the HR professionals in some corporates are actually just incompetent. Some may be both unethical and incompetent. The recruiters have no choice but to grin and bear their incompetence.
The time has come for the consultants to take over all the HR functions in corporates and not just recruitments.
Capt. Chand Pathak
Creative Indians
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Friends,
Eight Questions. Anyone brave enough to answer?
1. What do you call a person who takes credit for someone else's hard work?
2. Who are these people who indulge in these unethical practices of cheating others of their hard work?
3. Why do they do these things? What are their compulsions and motivations?
4. What kind of education would they have received?
5. Can we call that education?
6. What kind of upbringing, habits, lifestyles would these kinds of people have?
7. Are they themselves responsible, or should we blame their teachers, environment, system, society?
8. What can we do with these people? How do we treat them? Do they deserve respect?
Any answers?
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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Eight Questions. Anyone brave enough to answer?
1. What do you call a person who takes credit for someone else's hard work?
2. Who are these people who indulge in these unethical practices of cheating others of their hard work?
3. Why do they do these things? What are their compulsions and motivations?
4. What kind of education would they have received?
5. Can we call that education?
6. What kind of upbringing, habits, lifestyles would these kinds of people have?
7. Are they themselves responsible, or should we blame their teachers, environment, system, society?
8. What can we do with these people? How do we treat them? Do they deserve respect?
Any answers?
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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Hello Capt. Pathak,
I just went through your post and all replies to it. Having worked in consultancy as well as corporate culture, I do agree with the point raised by you and the facts attached to it. However, in my opinion, we have black sheep in both industries. A few corporate HRs are definitely misusing their positions, but we must not forget about those consultants who encourage or have actually started this practice. Everyone is trying to save their own jobs without considering the methods through which they are achieving this.
I would say that idealistically, your view is to be appreciated and contemplated, but practically, either the whole system has to be changed, or we will simply be posting blogs and raising issues. Though my view may sound a bit philosophical, the fact remains that it is a vicious circle in which corporate HRs and consultants keep falling.
Regards,
Meghna
From India
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I just went through your post and all replies to it. Having worked in consultancy as well as corporate culture, I do agree with the point raised by you and the facts attached to it. However, in my opinion, we have black sheep in both industries. A few corporate HRs are definitely misusing their positions, but we must not forget about those consultants who encourage or have actually started this practice. Everyone is trying to save their own jobs without considering the methods through which they are achieving this.
I would say that idealistically, your view is to be appreciated and contemplated, but practically, either the whole system has to be changed, or we will simply be posting blogs and raising issues. Though my view may sound a bit philosophical, the fact remains that it is a vicious circle in which corporate HRs and consultants keep falling.
Regards,
Meghna
From India
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Dear Meghna,
How right you are!
I believe you can't do much about the black sheep. I don't think they would have an intention to change themselves or the situation we are in. I feel these kinds of discussions can at least stimulate conscience in those who may be sitting on the fence, so to say. All those who are capable of mending ways and awakening their conscience.
I agree it sounds like idealistic crap to a lot of people... but then these are the people in question who need to be addressed, right? Somebody has to sound boring and idealistic :(
And each one of us has to start with self. I am reminded of Michael Jackson's beautiful song "Man in the Mirror":
"I'm Gonna Make A Change,
For Once In My Life
It's Gonna Feel Real Good,
Gonna Make A Difference
Gonna Make It Right . . .
I'm Starting With The Man In
The Mirror
I'm Asking Him To Change
His Ways
And No Message Could Have
Been Any Clearer
If You Wanna Make The World
A Better Place
Take A Look At Yourself, And
Then Make A Change..."
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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How right you are!
I believe you can't do much about the black sheep. I don't think they would have an intention to change themselves or the situation we are in. I feel these kinds of discussions can at least stimulate conscience in those who may be sitting on the fence, so to say. All those who are capable of mending ways and awakening their conscience.
I agree it sounds like idealistic crap to a lot of people... but then these are the people in question who need to be addressed, right? Somebody has to sound boring and idealistic :(
And each one of us has to start with self. I am reminded of Michael Jackson's beautiful song "Man in the Mirror":
"I'm Gonna Make A Change,
For Once In My Life
It's Gonna Feel Real Good,
Gonna Make A Difference
Gonna Make It Right . . .
I'm Starting With The Man In
The Mirror
I'm Asking Him To Change
His Ways
And No Message Could Have
Been Any Clearer
If You Wanna Make The World
A Better Place
Take A Look At Yourself, And
Then Make A Change..."
Capt. Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
Acknowledge(0)Amend(0)
I just came across this posting and I thought I could first answer these questions as if it were put across to me. SEE MY REPLY IN RED COLOUR!
Dear Friends,
As a recruitment consultant, I have often faced some serious issues from some HR professionals, and I feel concerned about the deteriorating ethical standards in the HR community.
These are as follows:
1. An URGENT position needing to be closed ASAP is put on "HOLD" soon after we have sent some very good and relevant profiles. (Maybe they have found what they were looking for, go ahead and search for that person's profile on their own) - No. It's just that we have also been working too hard on it. We give it to you only if it's a real tough position. But unfortunately, the Senior Management pulls off by stating that we can put the position on hold due to internal reasons. Some of these reasons we can't share with you because it's internal matters.
2. They stop giving feedback to the profiles sent after you have sent a sizable number of relevant profiles to another "URGENT" position. A week later they declare it closed, no explanation given!
Sizeable number - agreed. But they are the same profiles we sourced for. A couple of them are already in the pipeline. You will think that we cheated you. (One consultant shouted when we said that we already have their submitted profile with us and is in the shortlisting process).
3. The most relevant profile will always be "duplicate," even though no one has contacted the candidate for the position. There are a lot of other issues (asking for commission, using consultants for creating a database of candidates, delayed payments, non-payments, etc.) where we have strong feelings of foul play and unfair/unethical practices, taking the poor consultant for a ride on various pretexts, and sometimes openly.
Oh, how poor the consultants are?? A candidate we hired through a consultant (previous company) came at a cost of 2L to be paid to the consultant. The candidate left in a month's time. When the payment had to be made by us, you were perfect in follow-up. But as per the agreement, the amount has to be repaid, or the person has to be replaced. Our sweetheart consultants did neither and still give a wide smile (stating - sorry, I can't repay you, nor do I have a better profile).
The consultant bears the brunt as he does not wish to lose a client and is seen as being suspicious. Moreover, the consultants competing with each other have no way out but to give in to the whims and fancies of the clients and the HR professionals.
In our case, we dropped such clients immediately!
I would request everybody's inputs and experiences in this regard.
My question is why can't we Indians practice what we preach? And why don't we have any problems following unethical practices towards a service provider we feel is subservient to us?
Can anything be done to improve the life of the poor recruitment consultant? Is there a way out for them?
Yours truly,
Capt Chand Pathak
9818696454
Dear Capt Chand Pathak...
I understand - some consultants have a bad time.
There is one thing that keeps my working relationship with a consultant really good - just because of their professionalism, the way they take their work seriously... they don't nag us at THE WRONG TIMES. Never just dump resumes like other consultants who just pull them from Naukri and Monster - and we already have those profiles. They never try to force us to accept that the candidate is good.
Because ultimately the corporate recruiter will have to complete the job in the specified time... be it through an ad or a consultant's help. If it's a great profile, why shouldn't they get back? Big deal - be in constant touch with candidates and ask them if they received any calls.
They have worked in such a way that we reveal the names of people already in the process... so they don't get back to us with the same profile.
And if you are saying only Indians are like that... please. A leading Fortune 500 Pharmaceutical Company (was also in papers for drugs related to Vytorin and Zetia) had hired my services during the initial period of my career - to find sales reps for the Central and West zones. Trust me - I sent close to 250 profiles in three months, and they said they still did not hire. Luckily, during a call with the VP - HR, he said that no such positions existed. The Hiring Manager was fired - as he just used it as a database for the future.
And we got access to their ATS and found that 2 candidates we submitted were already placed.
You know what? They have still not paid us for it. What say?
From India, Madras
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Dear Friends,
As a recruitment consultant, I have often faced some serious issues from some HR professionals, and I feel concerned about the deteriorating ethical standards in the HR community.
These are as follows:
1. An URGENT position needing to be closed ASAP is put on "HOLD" soon after we have sent some very good and relevant profiles. (Maybe they have found what they were looking for, go ahead and search for that person's profile on their own) - No. It's just that we have also been working too hard on it. We give it to you only if it's a real tough position. But unfortunately, the Senior Management pulls off by stating that we can put the position on hold due to internal reasons. Some of these reasons we can't share with you because it's internal matters.
2. They stop giving feedback to the profiles sent after you have sent a sizable number of relevant profiles to another "URGENT" position. A week later they declare it closed, no explanation given!
Sizeable number - agreed. But they are the same profiles we sourced for. A couple of them are already in the pipeline. You will think that we cheated you. (One consultant shouted when we said that we already have their submitted profile with us and is in the shortlisting process).
3. The most relevant profile will always be "duplicate," even though no one has contacted the candidate for the position. There are a lot of other issues (asking for commission, using consultants for creating a database of candidates, delayed payments, non-payments, etc.) where we have strong feelings of foul play and unfair/unethical practices, taking the poor consultant for a ride on various pretexts, and sometimes openly.
Oh, how poor the consultants are?? A candidate we hired through a consultant (previous company) came at a cost of 2L to be paid to the consultant. The candidate left in a month's time. When the payment had to be made by us, you were perfect in follow-up. But as per the agreement, the amount has to be repaid, or the person has to be replaced. Our sweetheart consultants did neither and still give a wide smile (stating - sorry, I can't repay you, nor do I have a better profile).
The consultant bears the brunt as he does not wish to lose a client and is seen as being suspicious. Moreover, the consultants competing with each other have no way out but to give in to the whims and fancies of the clients and the HR professionals.
In our case, we dropped such clients immediately!
I would request everybody's inputs and experiences in this regard.
My question is why can't we Indians practice what we preach? And why don't we have any problems following unethical practices towards a service provider we feel is subservient to us?
Can anything be done to improve the life of the poor recruitment consultant? Is there a way out for them?
Yours truly,
Capt Chand Pathak
9818696454
Dear Capt Chand Pathak...
I understand - some consultants have a bad time.
There is one thing that keeps my working relationship with a consultant really good - just because of their professionalism, the way they take their work seriously... they don't nag us at THE WRONG TIMES. Never just dump resumes like other consultants who just pull them from Naukri and Monster - and we already have those profiles. They never try to force us to accept that the candidate is good.
Because ultimately the corporate recruiter will have to complete the job in the specified time... be it through an ad or a consultant's help. If it's a great profile, why shouldn't they get back? Big deal - be in constant touch with candidates and ask them if they received any calls.
They have worked in such a way that we reveal the names of people already in the process... so they don't get back to us with the same profile.
And if you are saying only Indians are like that... please. A leading Fortune 500 Pharmaceutical Company (was also in papers for drugs related to Vytorin and Zetia) had hired my services during the initial period of my career - to find sales reps for the Central and West zones. Trust me - I sent close to 250 profiles in three months, and they said they still did not hire. Luckily, during a call with the VP - HR, he said that no such positions existed. The Hiring Manager was fired - as he just used it as a database for the future.
And we got access to their ATS and found that 2 candidates we submitted were already placed.
You know what? They have still not paid us for it. What say?
From India, Madras
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Dear Asha,
I am confused. I am presuming you were a consultant or worked with a consultant in the early part of your career. So, you know that the hiring manager is capable of cheating you of your hard work. Sometimes, under pressure to show their own output, corporate recruiters use consultants' services and take credit for it. This happens all the time. A lot of HR professionals follow unethical practices in the corporate world, and so do recruitment consultants.
The consultants are as much a part of the HR community as any HR professional in a corporate setting. You'll be surprised at the number of ex-HR professionals who are running consultancies. Many have vast experience in all HR functions and understand HRD very well. Many who join corporates have been part of consultancies!
So, I really don't understand your "Us" and "You" divide. Perhaps you look down upon consultants and are happy to be part of a "corporate." Not many professionals commented in this thread, as I feel most of them agreed by being silent!
Regards,
Capt Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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I am confused. I am presuming you were a consultant or worked with a consultant in the early part of your career. So, you know that the hiring manager is capable of cheating you of your hard work. Sometimes, under pressure to show their own output, corporate recruiters use consultants' services and take credit for it. This happens all the time. A lot of HR professionals follow unethical practices in the corporate world, and so do recruitment consultants.
The consultants are as much a part of the HR community as any HR professional in a corporate setting. You'll be surprised at the number of ex-HR professionals who are running consultancies. Many have vast experience in all HR functions and understand HRD very well. Many who join corporates have been part of consultancies!
So, I really don't understand your "Us" and "You" divide. Perhaps you look down upon consultants and are happy to be part of a "corporate." Not many professionals commented in this thread, as I feel most of them agreed by being silent!
Regards,
Capt Chand Pathak
From India, Lucknow
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Dear Captain,
I started as a consultant for US Fortune 500 clients, so I know the hard work involved. But when I joined a corporate and requested help from consultants for a position that I worked so hard on, they gave me the same profiles they found on the job board.
I finally taught them how to do cold calling, gate crash the secretaries, and find names, but they still did not improve. I could not sit and do what I did earlier because here, my focus is not only recruitments but many other issues too.
I just got fed up with their service (a couple of them were good, and I felt it was important to keep them in the good books too). I did not really divide the consultants and corporate people. I am still happy that I was earlier a part of a good consulting team, but not all consultants live up to good standards.
I know the hard work involved. I can easily find out from my consultant if he had truly found a passive profile.
It's just that I am very tough in giving the positions for consultants to work on because it takes just a dedicated recruiter to reduce the cost involved. I put in my 100% just to make sure it does not go to an outside consultant. You may feel like throwing stones at me, but look at this, Sir. In one hire, a consultant got close to 2 lakhs (that was my last company salary per annum). He got it just for one hire! And that hire left the work in two months. The consultant did not pay the amount or replace the candidate and did not have the courtesy to follow up either.
And imagine, when cost-cutting came, I had to ask my assistant to leave because of the huge recruitment bill.
And that too, I still feel bad because I found the same profile on the net, and his profile was rejected by my Head of HR. But when the consultant submitted, the MD wanted to have a look, and then it turned into a hire, and very soon, the person also left.
It's not that I am enjoying being a part of the corporate. It's my duty. When I am recruited for recruitments, I should do it at minimal costs. If I have to give it to a consultant, then I must resign as I am not capable.
Working with consultants has just been a bad experience for me (again, I say 1 or 2 have been okay with the way they follow up, and they never nag us).
The reason why I quoted about my experience with a US company is that it's not that Indians are not good. Even people outside play games. Please don't categorize it as "Indians only".
I don't like anyone saying that, as if other countries have not proved their professionalism!
From India, Madras
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I started as a consultant for US Fortune 500 clients, so I know the hard work involved. But when I joined a corporate and requested help from consultants for a position that I worked so hard on, they gave me the same profiles they found on the job board.
I finally taught them how to do cold calling, gate crash the secretaries, and find names, but they still did not improve. I could not sit and do what I did earlier because here, my focus is not only recruitments but many other issues too.
I just got fed up with their service (a couple of them were good, and I felt it was important to keep them in the good books too). I did not really divide the consultants and corporate people. I am still happy that I was earlier a part of a good consulting team, but not all consultants live up to good standards.
I know the hard work involved. I can easily find out from my consultant if he had truly found a passive profile.
It's just that I am very tough in giving the positions for consultants to work on because it takes just a dedicated recruiter to reduce the cost involved. I put in my 100% just to make sure it does not go to an outside consultant. You may feel like throwing stones at me, but look at this, Sir. In one hire, a consultant got close to 2 lakhs (that was my last company salary per annum). He got it just for one hire! And that hire left the work in two months. The consultant did not pay the amount or replace the candidate and did not have the courtesy to follow up either.
And imagine, when cost-cutting came, I had to ask my assistant to leave because of the huge recruitment bill.
And that too, I still feel bad because I found the same profile on the net, and his profile was rejected by my Head of HR. But when the consultant submitted, the MD wanted to have a look, and then it turned into a hire, and very soon, the person also left.
It's not that I am enjoying being a part of the corporate. It's my duty. When I am recruited for recruitments, I should do it at minimal costs. If I have to give it to a consultant, then I must resign as I am not capable.
Working with consultants has just been a bad experience for me (again, I say 1 or 2 have been okay with the way they follow up, and they never nag us).
The reason why I quoted about my experience with a US company is that it's not that Indians are not good. Even people outside play games. Please don't categorize it as "Indians only".
I don't like anyone saying that, as if other countries have not proved their professionalism!
From India, Madras
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Hi Pathak,
Whatever you have said, it's really true. I have also worked in an HR consulting firm and I have faced the same difficulties. You know, it's like a game where only the HR managers have the right to play. They think that there are a lot of consultancies in the market, and they are not going to lose anything. As and when the requirement is given to the consultancies, they put in their effort, the operational cost, employee cost, everything is being borne by the consultancies. The companies have to pay money only when the position gets closed. So, it's in the HR's hand; he/she can do anything they wish.
So they come up with so many reasons, either position "HOLD" or "DUPLICATE" or some other reasons, or just to build the database as they don't want to pay the consulting fees.
On the other hand, these poor consultants put their efforts as it does matter to them as they have to fulfill their target. At the end of the end, the sufferer is only the "poor consultants." If the position is not closed, then the entire blame is on the consultants, as he is not compatible, not performing, and so on. But nobody uses to see the man-hours he has put into the job.
It's really shameful that being an HR of a company, they do all unethical practices. It's really difficult to change the mindset, but the only thing I can tell you is that only that person knows the pain who has gone through it. So, the only thing we can do is to keep ourselves committed towards our work and not practice these unethical practices.
Now I am working in an IT concern, and at least from my side, I have never done this as I know the pain faced by the consultants in closing a position.
Regards,
Kasturi Das
From India, Madras
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Whatever you have said, it's really true. I have also worked in an HR consulting firm and I have faced the same difficulties. You know, it's like a game where only the HR managers have the right to play. They think that there are a lot of consultancies in the market, and they are not going to lose anything. As and when the requirement is given to the consultancies, they put in their effort, the operational cost, employee cost, everything is being borne by the consultancies. The companies have to pay money only when the position gets closed. So, it's in the HR's hand; he/she can do anything they wish.
So they come up with so many reasons, either position "HOLD" or "DUPLICATE" or some other reasons, or just to build the database as they don't want to pay the consulting fees.
On the other hand, these poor consultants put their efforts as it does matter to them as they have to fulfill their target. At the end of the end, the sufferer is only the "poor consultants." If the position is not closed, then the entire blame is on the consultants, as he is not compatible, not performing, and so on. But nobody uses to see the man-hours he has put into the job.
It's really shameful that being an HR of a company, they do all unethical practices. It's really difficult to change the mindset, but the only thing I can tell you is that only that person knows the pain who has gone through it. So, the only thing we can do is to keep ourselves committed towards our work and not practice these unethical practices.
Now I am working in an IT concern, and at least from my side, I have never done this as I know the pain faced by the consultants in closing a position.
Regards,
Kasturi Das
From India, Madras
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Hi all,
Ravi, I agree with you on the same. Whatever you do, you get back the same from nature. So, how much longer would one run? One day or the other, they need to stop. Many HR professionals take their positions for granted, whereas some HR professionals like you and me are still humble. But, for whatever bad things these HR professionals do, they would get back the same. I too was once a victim of these illiterate HR professionals, wherein they didn't have any information, and later on, because of their laid-back and arrogant attitude, I noticed that it was the wrong decision to approach that company.
From India, Mumbai
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Ravi, I agree with you on the same. Whatever you do, you get back the same from nature. So, how much longer would one run? One day or the other, they need to stop. Many HR professionals take their positions for granted, whereas some HR professionals like you and me are still humble. But, for whatever bad things these HR professionals do, they would get back the same. I too was once a victim of these illiterate HR professionals, wherein they didn't have any information, and later on, because of their laid-back and arrogant attitude, I noticed that it was the wrong decision to approach that company.
From India, Mumbai
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User input:
"Gee, tnx i'm not a politician...."
Correction:
"Gee, thanks, I'm not a politician."
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From Philippines, Malolos
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"Gee, tnx i'm not a politician...."
Correction:
"Gee, thanks, I'm not a politician."
---
hiringvenue.com - Free Online Resume and Job Ads Posting
<link outdated-removed>
capitanhosting.com - Affordable and Reliable web hosting solutions
---
I have corrected the spelling and grammar errors in the text and ensured proper paragraph formatting. Let me know if you need further assistance.
From Philippines, Malolos
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