Dear All,
I need advice from all veterans here. Our organization has around 230 people, and we want to bring more people on the payroll, but we don't want to start a canteen. Is there any option available to have more than 250 employees on the roll without a canteen?
Please reply.
Gauri
From India, Mumbai
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47I need advice from all veterans here. Our organization has around 230 people, and we want to bring more people on the payroll, but we don't want to start a canteen. Is there any option available to have more than 250 employees on the roll without a canteen?
Please reply.
Gauri
From India, Mumbai
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As per the Factories Act, you are expected to have a canteen to provide subsidized food to workers if you have at least 250 employees, either directly or through contractors. However, merely employing 250 employees does not mandate setting up a canteen. The obligation to have a statutory canteen arises only after the state government declares, through a separate notification, that your establishment should have a canteen as prescribed under the Act. Moreover, should you reduce the required manpower just to avoid setting up a canteen? Consider this.
Regards,
Madhu.T.K
From India, Kannur
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Regards,
Madhu.T.K
From India, Kannur
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Thanks, Madhu. Can you please explain under what conditions a state government declares, by separate notification, that an establishment should have a canteen? Until one receives this notification, can a company operate without a canteen even with 250 employees?
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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Dear seniors, is it that nobody here knows about the Factories Act? Can anybody tell me if for the canteen, both staff and workers are counted, or only workers are counted as 250? Any response would be appreciated.
From India, Mumbai
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From India, Mumbai
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Hello Gauri, Why don't you respond to Madhu's comment--just to avoid a canteen should you reduce the manpower required? Others could respond more appropriately if you give the FULL & COMPLETE details. Frankly, prima facie, it's very natural, logical, and fair/ethical to provide canteen facilities when there are so many employees -250 is just a figure that the Govt puts on to define it. Then why does your company want to avoid such a legitimate and fair facility for the sake of the employees? It does look like the advice of this Forum members has every chance of being misused. The very fact that, despite Madhu's remarks, you have asked: "so until one gets this can a company run without a canteen even with 250 employees" leads one to believe it's so. If my reading is wrong, please let me know with the 'why' of it. Regards, TS
From India, Hyderabad
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From India, Hyderabad
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Dear TS,
I appreciate your reply. Gauri, when you are aware of the law, why are you waiting for someone to instruct you to enforce it? Please never bend the rules or find loopholes to escape the law. If you have a Strength of 250, then definitely go for Canteen Options. Explore the market; there are plenty of providers available.
Conduct a survey with your employees, finalize the menu and pricing with the employees' representative, and proceed. If you dodge the law, it will strike back with a power a thousand times stronger. Our senior has clearly mentioned that the Strength should be 250, meaning collectively. Please do not post such types of questions. Is it that nobody here knows about the Factories Act?
The reply seems a bit rude, so let's maintain decency and respect for all members.
Regards,
SIDMAN
From India, Madras
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I appreciate your reply. Gauri, when you are aware of the law, why are you waiting for someone to instruct you to enforce it? Please never bend the rules or find loopholes to escape the law. If you have a Strength of 250, then definitely go for Canteen Options. Explore the market; there are plenty of providers available.
Conduct a survey with your employees, finalize the menu and pricing with the employees' representative, and proceed. If you dodge the law, it will strike back with a power a thousand times stronger. Our senior has clearly mentioned that the Strength should be 250, meaning collectively. Please do not post such types of questions. Is it that nobody here knows about the Factories Act?
The reply seems a bit rude, so let's maintain decency and respect for all members.
Regards,
SIDMAN
From India, Madras
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Dear Sidman,
Thank you for your reply. You are right, but to initiate anything, expenses have to be considered. In my opinion, HR represents both the employer and the employee, so you have to find a way to help employees. That is my only intention in asking this question. If anybody finds it rude, I am sorry about it.
From India, Mumbai
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Thank you for your reply. You are right, but to initiate anything, expenses have to be considered. In my opinion, HR represents both the employer and the employee, so you have to find a way to help employees. That is my only intention in asking this question. If anybody finds it rude, I am sorry about it.
From India, Mumbai
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Dear TS,
Thank you for your reply. Please do not assume that the advice given here can be misused. You can also seek advice from your consultants, even though they are paid for it. However, I am attempting to find a middle ground, hence the reason for asking this question. We are also contemplating providing food subsidies as a potential replacement for the canteen, with the intention of being natural, logical, and fair/ethical.
I raised this question because, when you refer to factory laws, there is a stipulation that if your company has 250 employees and any appropriate government body notifies you to take certain actions... This is why I revisited the topic even after receiving Madhur's response. It is crucial that things are not misinterpreted. I am unsure why people in HR tend to have a negative outlook.
Thank you.
From India, Mumbai
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Thank you for your reply. Please do not assume that the advice given here can be misused. You can also seek advice from your consultants, even though they are paid for it. However, I am attempting to find a middle ground, hence the reason for asking this question. We are also contemplating providing food subsidies as a potential replacement for the canteen, with the intention of being natural, logical, and fair/ethical.
I raised this question because, when you refer to factory laws, there is a stipulation that if your company has 250 employees and any appropriate government body notifies you to take certain actions... This is why I revisited the topic even after receiving Madhur's response. It is crucial that things are not misinterpreted. I am unsure why people in HR tend to have a negative outlook.
Thank you.
From India, Mumbai
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Hello Gauri,
I can understand your concern/feeling. But look at the inputs you gave so far this way: had you mentioned about the possibility of food subsidy right in the beginning, do you think me or anyone would even think whether the query was genuine or not? Like they say; if you want the right answer, one has to ask the right question - which also includes/means the full inputs. And please don't think that advice/suggestions can't be misused. Anything can be used or misused -- it all depends on the individual implementing the advice. There are quite a few who do -- and unfortunately the pattern of such people asking also gives half-baked inputs when asking for advice -- which is why my thinking went in that direction for your query. Hope that clarifies the point.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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I can understand your concern/feeling. But look at the inputs you gave so far this way: had you mentioned about the possibility of food subsidy right in the beginning, do you think me or anyone would even think whether the query was genuine or not? Like they say; if you want the right answer, one has to ask the right question - which also includes/means the full inputs. And please don't think that advice/suggestions can't be misused. Anything can be used or misused -- it all depends on the individual implementing the advice. There are quite a few who do -- and unfortunately the pattern of such people asking also gives half-baked inputs when asking for advice -- which is why my thinking went in that direction for your query. Hope that clarifies the point.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear Gauri IR,
It seems you are a bit in a dilemma about how to proceed with the canteen. Can you tell me if you have restroom facilities available? The canteen can also accommodate this need.
There are many clauses and intricacies in all the Acts; we should not seek to escape or find loopholes. It is better to run a business ethically and abide by the regulations. In our country, these Acts are more lenient towards employers compared to other countries.
However, let's promote fair employee practices.
Thanks and regards,
KM
From India, Madras
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It seems you are a bit in a dilemma about how to proceed with the canteen. Can you tell me if you have restroom facilities available? The canteen can also accommodate this need.
There are many clauses and intricacies in all the Acts; we should not seek to escape or find loopholes. It is better to run a business ethically and abide by the regulations. In our country, these Acts are more lenient towards employers compared to other countries.
However, let's promote fair employee practices.
Thanks and regards,
KM
From India, Madras
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Section 46 of the Factories Act, which deals with the canteen, states that the State Government is empowered to issue a notification directing the occupier/employer of a specified factory to establish a canteen. The number of employees for the purpose of the applicability of section 46 will include all employees because a canteen cannot be restricted to a certain category of employees only. It is up to the management to decide whether or not to wait until a notification or direction is issued.
Regards,
Madhu.T.K
From India, Kannur
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Regards,
Madhu.T.K
From India, Kannur
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Canteen Committee-Facto ries Act.docx