Hi Team,
Can anyone help? Is there any policy for IBM HR team not to accept a relieving letter via email confirmation without HR signature for a new joining employee? Whose fault is this - the employer who issued the email, the employee, or the IBM HR team?
Hope to have a discussion on this so that employees learn HR policies correctly.
Thanks,
HR Column
From India, Bangalore
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1Can anyone help? Is there any policy for IBM HR team not to accept a relieving letter via email confirmation without HR signature for a new joining employee? Whose fault is this - the employer who issued the email, the employee, or the IBM HR team?
Hope to have a discussion on this so that employees learn HR policies correctly.
Thanks,
HR Column
From India, Bangalore
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Hello HR Column, Could you pl give the details of the ACTUAL situation so that members can suggest/comment? Rgds, TS
From India, Hyderabad
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From India, Hyderabad
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Hi Tajsateesh,
Thank you for your reply.
Dear Everyone friends/members,
Here are the details step by step:
1. IBM has issued an offer letter.
2. They asked the candidate to join as soon as possible.
3. The candidate has requested their current employer's management to release them at the earliest due to personal problems.
4. The current employer quickly released the candidate with the notice period waived, approved by the General Manager, and confirmed the employee's release verbally.
5. The issue is that HR did not put any signature while sending the release email to the employee, only the HR name XXX was mentioned.
6. The employee trusted HR and forwarded the same email to the IBM HR team to confirm joining based on the email assurance.
7. IBM HR confirmed the joining over the telephone, requesting the candidate to join as soon as possible.
8. On the joining date, the IBM HR stated that they could not accept the release acceptance email as there was no signature from the last employer's HR. Whose fault is this? Can a release acceptance email/letter be served without full and final settlement to the employee? This is the question here.
9. The IBM HR team informed the candidate that they could not onboard them due to the absence of the HR signature from the last employer.
Please suggest a solution for the candidate and help the community. If you need more information, please feel free to write.
From India, Bangalore
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Thank you for your reply.
Dear Everyone friends/members,
Here are the details step by step:
1. IBM has issued an offer letter.
2. They asked the candidate to join as soon as possible.
3. The candidate has requested their current employer's management to release them at the earliest due to personal problems.
4. The current employer quickly released the candidate with the notice period waived, approved by the General Manager, and confirmed the employee's release verbally.
5. The issue is that HR did not put any signature while sending the release email to the employee, only the HR name XXX was mentioned.
6. The employee trusted HR and forwarded the same email to the IBM HR team to confirm joining based on the email assurance.
7. IBM HR confirmed the joining over the telephone, requesting the candidate to join as soon as possible.
8. On the joining date, the IBM HR stated that they could not accept the release acceptance email as there was no signature from the last employer's HR. Whose fault is this? Can a release acceptance email/letter be served without full and final settlement to the employee? This is the question here.
9. The IBM HR team informed the candidate that they could not onboard them due to the absence of the HR signature from the last employer.
Please suggest a solution for the candidate and help the community. If you need more information, please feel free to write.
From India, Bangalore
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Hello,
Prima facie, an email is usually considered as the initial step for any action, but it does not and cannot be regarded as a definitive document for final proof.
Forget about IBM for a moment—it is in your best interest (assuming it's your case rather than anyone else's) to have all the necessary documents (Relieving Letter, Experience Letter, Recommendations, etc.) on official letterheads with proper signatures. These documents are vital components of your career track record.
Given that even emails can be forged (commonly known as 'phishing'), no company views them as conclusive proof unless there is a specific reason to do so, which is determined on a case-by-case basis.
Regarding the available course of action, it is advisable to promptly contact the HR department of your previous company and obtain the formal documents to submit to IBM. Ideally, these documents should have been provided to you without the need for a request if all formal procedures have been duly completed.
Wishing you the best of luck.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Prima facie, an email is usually considered as the initial step for any action, but it does not and cannot be regarded as a definitive document for final proof.
Forget about IBM for a moment—it is in your best interest (assuming it's your case rather than anyone else's) to have all the necessary documents (Relieving Letter, Experience Letter, Recommendations, etc.) on official letterheads with proper signatures. These documents are vital components of your career track record.
Given that even emails can be forged (commonly known as 'phishing'), no company views them as conclusive proof unless there is a specific reason to do so, which is determined on a case-by-case basis.
Regarding the available course of action, it is advisable to promptly contact the HR department of your previous company and obtain the formal documents to submit to IBM. Ideally, these documents should have been provided to you without the need for a request if all formal procedures have been duly completed.
Wishing you the best of luck.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Dear TS,
Thank you for your reply. As per your suggestion, all steps were taken with the Old Employer HR by the candidate. The IBM HR has also tried to reach the HR of the old employee. The HR said that without full and final settlements, they cannot send a relieving letter. Agreed, but when they had accepted the resignation with mail but without a signature and had assured that they would send the relieving letter by scan and send courier, as informed to me by the candidate - why did they play tricks? What is the fear? Because of this, the entire working community is suffering. This CITE FORUM is helpful, and that's why people reach here. Hope a section of the community who does wrong things with employees is reading this post. Justice needs to be given to the right people.
From India, Bangalore
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Thank you for your reply. As per your suggestion, all steps were taken with the Old Employer HR by the candidate. The IBM HR has also tried to reach the HR of the old employee. The HR said that without full and final settlements, they cannot send a relieving letter. Agreed, but when they had accepted the resignation with mail but without a signature and had assured that they would send the relieving letter by scan and send courier, as informed to me by the candidate - why did they play tricks? What is the fear? Because of this, the entire working community is suffering. This CITE FORUM is helpful, and that's why people reach here. Hope a section of the community who does wrong things with employees is reading this post. Justice needs to be given to the right people.
From India, Bangalore
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Hello,
Please note that I had already mentioned this possibility when I used the words 'if all the formalities have been completed' in the end of my response.
Suggest meeting the HR of the earlier employer and sorting things out—basically to hasten/expedite the process. Some companies take 2-3 months for F&F even while issuing the relieving letter, on a subjective basis. Some companies do the F&F fast to coincide with the actual leaving of the employee.
If you take the 'hard approach' to the issue, it could only delay things further.
Please note that the issue here is not whether legal remedies are available or not—the issue is whether any of them need to be used, and face the possible consequences like a long court battle, the time, effort, and money involved instead of focusing on the career. It's up to the individual to take the final call on such an issue.
All the best.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Please note that I had already mentioned this possibility when I used the words 'if all the formalities have been completed' in the end of my response.
Suggest meeting the HR of the earlier employer and sorting things out—basically to hasten/expedite the process. Some companies take 2-3 months for F&F even while issuing the relieving letter, on a subjective basis. Some companies do the F&F fast to coincide with the actual leaving of the employee.
If you take the 'hard approach' to the issue, it could only delay things further.
Please note that the issue here is not whether legal remedies are available or not—the issue is whether any of them need to be used, and face the possible consequences like a long court battle, the time, effort, and money involved instead of focusing on the career. It's up to the individual to take the final call on such an issue.
All the best.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Appreciate your time, suggestions, and looking at the issue from your point of view. However, readers are not satisfied with a solution. If you can convince with your more progressive solutions, it would be helpful.
The bottom line is the industry is working differently on a case-by-case basis. No HR community is following a universally globally accepted rule. We have to accept this, though bitter. There are thousands of cases listed here in this forum where employees were forced to face the music because of certain people's adamant and poor mentality.
I, as part of the same community, know and understand the reality of what is happening inside the industry. As you mentioned F&F, if it takes 2 to 3 months, what should an employee do? Should they not change their job?
Namaste, brother again! To those who are following and reading this post, kindly advise with a convincing answer. Why does a section of the community play tricks, and because of this, the entire industry faces criticism?
From India, Bangalore
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The bottom line is the industry is working differently on a case-by-case basis. No HR community is following a universally globally accepted rule. We have to accept this, though bitter. There are thousands of cases listed here in this forum where employees were forced to face the music because of certain people's adamant and poor mentality.
I, as part of the same community, know and understand the reality of what is happening inside the industry. As you mentioned F&F, if it takes 2 to 3 months, what should an employee do? Should they not change their job?
Namaste, brother again! To those who are following and reading this post, kindly advise with a convincing answer. Why does a section of the community play tricks, and because of this, the entire industry faces criticism?
From India, Bangalore
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Hello,
I am not sure of your experience level, but I suggest being practical and realistic.
Whether we like it or not, that's how the world is. Please note that this is not to justify what I mentioned earlier or what your earlier employer did.
While appreciating, and to an extent agreeing with, your mention of "There are thousands of cases listed here in this forum where employees were forced to face the music because of certain people's adamant and poor mentality," in the same vein, there are also similar cases of employees jumping bonds, trying to find ways of giving short shrift to their employers, etc. By this, we definitely cannot generalize about all employees. Hope you get the point.
You had mentioned, "Current employer has relieved the candidate quickly with notice period waived." Were any reasons given to you why that decision was taken? It's not necessarily only because the employee asked for it.
Regarding full and final settlement taking 2 to 3 months, we know of cases where individuals received their full and final settlement cheques after they joined a new company. I think you are mixing up the full and final settlement process from the accounts point of view with the rest of the process.
You mentioned, "if you can convince with your more progressive solutions, it would be helpful." Can you please elaborate on what you mean by "more progressive"?
Please note that the solutions suggested in this forum are to focus on how to solve the issues of the members, not to impress any particular member. What works for one member may not work for another, as situations are more likely to be different than not. Furthermore, any post-mortem is essentially and only to the extent to learn from it, not to search for ways to hit back or indulge in negative responses. I presume this wasn't what you meant.
Is there any problem in trying out what I suggested earlier, "Suggest meeting the HR of the earlier employer"? Based on the details mentioned so far, I believe this could be the best way to resolve the issue. If this has already been tried out, please respond with details on what happened, etc.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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I am not sure of your experience level, but I suggest being practical and realistic.
Whether we like it or not, that's how the world is. Please note that this is not to justify what I mentioned earlier or what your earlier employer did.
While appreciating, and to an extent agreeing with, your mention of "There are thousands of cases listed here in this forum where employees were forced to face the music because of certain people's adamant and poor mentality," in the same vein, there are also similar cases of employees jumping bonds, trying to find ways of giving short shrift to their employers, etc. By this, we definitely cannot generalize about all employees. Hope you get the point.
You had mentioned, "Current employer has relieved the candidate quickly with notice period waived." Were any reasons given to you why that decision was taken? It's not necessarily only because the employee asked for it.
Regarding full and final settlement taking 2 to 3 months, we know of cases where individuals received their full and final settlement cheques after they joined a new company. I think you are mixing up the full and final settlement process from the accounts point of view with the rest of the process.
You mentioned, "if you can convince with your more progressive solutions, it would be helpful." Can you please elaborate on what you mean by "more progressive"?
Please note that the solutions suggested in this forum are to focus on how to solve the issues of the members, not to impress any particular member. What works for one member may not work for another, as situations are more likely to be different than not. Furthermore, any post-mortem is essentially and only to the extent to learn from it, not to search for ways to hit back or indulge in negative responses. I presume this wasn't what you meant.
Is there any problem in trying out what I suggested earlier, "Suggest meeting the HR of the earlier employer"? Based on the details mentioned so far, I believe this could be the best way to resolve the issue. If this has already been tried out, please respond with details on what happened, etc.
Regards,
TS
From India, Hyderabad
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Hello again,
You have given your time and tried to understand the issue. Thank you! As you said, some employees jump without following bond rules. Agreed - that's why I have mentioned justice should be given to the right people.
When I said Progressive Answer, it means - is it only meeting HR a solution? You also mentioned it's the personal call of the employee, finally, what he or she wants to do. Dispute, time-consuming for the employee... What are other solutions? Is there any controlling authority for both employee or employer - apart from management? Any institution that monitors all the cases genuinely in India. Time has come - we need to introspect on this. An independent institution where both employer and employee can write the grievances well.
There is no intention to impress or do any such - no time, please! Again, justice should be given to the right people.
Mentioned again - the notice period waived with a discussion with the Manager & HR team. Actually, the manager had waived the notice period. Maybe that was the case. The HR team felt ignored while taking decisions. Anyway, the latest news... talks are going on with HR - there was a small F&F settlement amount due, which is why they are delaying the relieving letter. But here, every company relieves the candidate and then does F&F (not mixing separately, it comes with this issue). The HR had sent an email of relieving but did not put a signature while sending the email of relieving - tricks.
Hope all is clear now. If you need further details, please feel free to ask. Namaste!
From India, Bangalore
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You have given your time and tried to understand the issue. Thank you! As you said, some employees jump without following bond rules. Agreed - that's why I have mentioned justice should be given to the right people.
When I said Progressive Answer, it means - is it only meeting HR a solution? You also mentioned it's the personal call of the employee, finally, what he or she wants to do. Dispute, time-consuming for the employee... What are other solutions? Is there any controlling authority for both employee or employer - apart from management? Any institution that monitors all the cases genuinely in India. Time has come - we need to introspect on this. An independent institution where both employer and employee can write the grievances well.
There is no intention to impress or do any such - no time, please! Again, justice should be given to the right people.
Mentioned again - the notice period waived with a discussion with the Manager & HR team. Actually, the manager had waived the notice period. Maybe that was the case. The HR team felt ignored while taking decisions. Anyway, the latest news... talks are going on with HR - there was a small F&F settlement amount due, which is why they are delaying the relieving letter. But here, every company relieves the candidate and then does F&F (not mixing separately, it comes with this issue). The HR had sent an email of relieving but did not put a signature while sending the email of relieving - tricks.
Hope all is clear now. If you need further details, please feel free to ask. Namaste!
From India, Bangalore
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Resignation cum relieving letter.doc