Dipil
Safety Consultant
Raghuvaran Chakkaravarthy
Environmental, Health And Safety
Kesava Pillai
Occupational Safety & Health
Abhaygirish
Hr Executive
PTRC
Working With Ngo
Rajesh.sorathia@gmail.com
Industrial Hse Professional
Gnvhari
Safety
+2 Others

Thread Started by #LACHHMAN

Many SHO too often discharge their responsibility in cases of accident.As a practioner I humbly acknowledged that we have a significant part of responsibility. we should as failures from different areas.Be it as advisor or trainer ,trainer.
21st November 2010 From Mauritius, Vacoas
@AJAY LACHHMAN
Dear Sir
What you mean by SHO... Is that Safety Health Officer?...
Also please make it clear what was your aim behind starting this thread?... Just to remind about the role of a Safety Pro or anything else?...
21st November 2010 From India
Hi Dipil
Sorry for having not been clear.In fact, I wanted just to add on an existing threat whereby some friends were question the role and responsiblities of safety and health officers/practioners in cases of accidents......Too often SHO try to discharge themselve arguing that its the responsibility on floor managers etc.....
However i would much appreciate to get your reflection on this issue
Regards
u may contact me on
22nd November 2010 From Mauritius, Vacoas
Role of SHO is that of advisory. His responsibility is to help management develop systems to prevent accidents, review- update- evaluate the system, analyze data on accidents and present the results before the mgmt for improvement, help generate awareness through various media/methods among ALL sections, prepare budget and get it sanctioned and then use the available funds meticulously and so on.
Accident taking place indicates some failure some where for which SHO can not be held responsible. Accidents happen when there are more than one failures. SHO's job is to locate ALL failures and improve up on ALL identified lacunae
23rd November 2010 From India, Coimbatore
Dear All
In my organization when comes to Incident & Incident Investigation Process, a Safety Pro is having the following role only:
1. Support and advise the line manager with incident investigation, including classification and to provide medical assistance.
2. Custodian of the incident information retained in the Incident Investigation Report and ensures that the data is validated. Ensure legal compliance and report incidents to regulatory authorities.
Just would like to know the comments of all on this account...
A Safety Pro suppose to do any additional function in case an incident than mentioned above?
23rd November 2010 From India
Thanks for your reflections.
You will appreciate that failure to make proper risk assessment,hazards analysis and accident investigation which are inter alias the attributions of SHOs may perpetuate hazardous conditions at workplace .In this respect i feel that SHO should bear the responsibility.
However I value equally your points
thanks
24th November 2010 From Mauritius, Vacoas
Yesterday fire and explosion took place in a factory in Nandesari ind area near Baroda killing one worker. SHO has been arrested by the police along with CEO and others.Do you think SHO has criminal responsibility? I myself was SHSO at a chemical factory and my advise was not accepted or implemented which was very frustrating.Do you think that in such cases SHO should approach the Factory Inspectorate to make complaint against the Management?
24th November 2010 From India, Coimbatore
Dear Mr.PTRC,

Since Industrial accidents are covered under Factories act and rules only the State Chief Inspector of Factories is the one authorized to investigate and file a case against the Occupier. However police can arrest the SHO and CEO for willful negligence only causing the accident and its result.

Against an offence two different authorities can not go ahead with the proceedings.

When State Chief Inspector files a case usually the Police case will be dropped.

SHO is having only staff function and not executive functions and as such he is supposed to provide solid recommendation to his reporting officer on his part. If his recommendations are not implemented which results in an accident he is not answerable for the accident. Once this is proved on his side he will be set free.

SHO is an employee of the organization. He is not paid or employed by Factory Inspectorate. All the correspondence to inspectorate is done by the Factory Manager or occupier. Again inspectorate is not dealing with the SHO directly. Under these conditions SHO is not supposed to report anything directly to inspectorate with out instructions from his reporting officer. However when time comes and asked for with the permission of reporting officer he may be directed to produce documents such as his recommendations.

SHO or any employee making a complaint against an organization is called “whistle blower” which is legal in USA. Whistle blowers are well protected by OSHA there whereas in India it will be treated as a serious misconduct for which one can even be terminated.

However I will be thankful if you can give more information about the reported accident please.

Regards,

Kesava Pillai
24th November 2010 From India, Kollam
@PTRC & Keshav Pillai
Thanks for the updates...
Before this I have heard about two incidents where the SHO is arrested...
One question: Chief Inspector can visit the accident spot any time within 30 days of accident. During his visit, if he found any abnormalities, specialy unsafe conditions, then only he will proceed in filing a case or not?
24th November 2010 From India
Dear Kesava sir ,
As per my experience S.O. always giving recommendations for safety of workplace as per his knowledge level ( Competency ) . sometimes I found that small/medium industries not sent them(s.o) for external training or taking advise of external experts on critical issues also due to cost factor in that case how it is logical to make responsible to safety officer for an accident . Do you think that Human Resource & Development dept.is also responsible for allowing to employ less competent person ? . I have worked with some small/medium scale industries where safety officer used to verbal communication only in such cases how s.o. will able to give proof of his recommendation . Kindly guide.
Regards,
Abhay
24th November 2010 From India, Mumbai
Dear All,
This is a good discusion. Safety Officers role is suggestive role. Many times his suggestions are not taking into consideration by managements also. when an accident took place everyone including management also look to the safety officer for his explanation. If it is the reportable accident he has to undergo for the criminal proceedings. How pity a safety officers job.
View the attachment for "How deviate a safety officers suggestions".
Regards
Srinivasa Rao. M
25th November 2010 From India, Calcutta

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File Type: pdf What your Safety Officer wanted.pdf (116.5 KB, 1413 views)

@ Srinivasa Rao. M
Great attachment... What I understand from the same is, that there is a requirement to install one swing... Different views regarding the same from people is what shows through the pictures... In which only Safety Officer come forward/think about a standard swing...
I hope I correctly understood, or else please correct me and come foraward with right interpretations...
Great contribution and keep on participate and share your expertise with us...
25th November 2010 From India
Dear All,

Following news paper report may interest you:

Nandesari fire: KDAC Chem employee held

Owner, Three Others Booked In Case

The Times of India, 25th November 2010

Vadodara: Police have arrested one person in connection with Nandesari-GIDC fire incident that claimed one life and left seven injured. C M Jhalani, security manager of KDAC Chem Private Ltd, was arrested as he was responsible for the factory’s security and safety. A police complaint was registered against four persons including owner of KDAC on Monday night.

The cops have registered offence of culpable homicide not amounting to murder under IPC section 304 and others which included vitiating atmosphere so as to make it noxious to health. The other accused have been identified as owner Dhansukh Gaur, Kamal Chandani and K K Patel. “We will seek remand of Jhalani from a local court on Wednesday. He was arrested as he was responsible for the security of the factory premises,” said Chhani police inspector T P Parmar.

“We will arrest the other accused soon as investigations are on,” Parmar added. Jagdish Gohil, an employee of the KDAC was killed when several blasts ripped through the company’s plant on Monday morning. Police officials and officers of Directorate, Industrial Health and Safety (DISH) Department are jointly investigating the reasons behind the accident.

An officer from DISH visited the factory premise on Tuesday to ascertain whether any more bodies were trapped inside the plant. “We checked the factory premises and found that there was no other casualty. We are now trying to ascertain the reasons behind the event,” said P M Shah, factory inspector.

The incident spread panic in Nandesari-GIDC that houses hundreds of chemical units. About 20 factories located in the vicinity of KDAC suffered damages due to the blasts and fire. When the first blast occurred, most of the workers rushed out of the factory even as Gohil stayed back to close the valve of the boiler. However, a second blast flung Gohil in air and his badly charred body was recovered some time later by firebrigade officials.

“The incident has again raised issues of safety in industrial areas. The government just doesn’t understand the hazards of chemical disaster. If reports prepared after such accidents are not taken seriously, citizens might face face worse tragedies than the Bhopal gas leakage,” said environment activist, Rohit Prajapati. “I had demanded details of accidents in chemical units, reports made after the accidents and action taken by the government from Gujarat State Disaster Management Authority in June this year under the RTI Act. But, my application was directed to another department. I’m yet to get any information,” Prajapati added.
26th November 2010 From India, Coimbatore
Thanks to all friends who commented on the issue;
The case mentioned by MR.PTRC at Baroda have lot of administrative and legal implications.
As Mr.Kesava rightly pin out there are no an standard approach of reporting or making recommendations inspite that the law provide for a reporting system.
I stronly belief that the reporting line of SHO should be reviewed.SHO SHOULD REPORT TO THE CEO IF IN LAW THEY ARE BOTH ACCOUNABLE FOR ACCIDENT OCCURENCE.
THANK YOU MR. PILLAI FOR YOUR COMMENTS
26th November 2010 From Mauritius, Vacoas
Dear Abhay,

I always find something intersting in your posts which makes me happy too.

You may check with the statutes. No where it states that safety of the industry is vested with Safety Officer. You have to deal with the top brass for absolute responsibility for safety of his industry is vested only with him. He runs the industry. All others including Safety Officer are under his direction. Because of this now one of the Directors is made answerable for complying with statutory requirements on safety, health and welfare in India. Even appointing a Manager as in the past to escape responsibilty is not possible.

Arresting a Security Officer or safety Officer is only mokery. It may be to pacify the people aroud. In a mass psychology just for peace police have to play many games for chances of riot at accident scenes are quite common. After a few days everything goes normal.

It is better we don’t discuss much about the caliber of a safety officer in India as of now. If he is good at entertaining the Inspector he will be good. With that there will not be any adverse remarks and mangement will also be happy with it.

How often the Inspector really inspects a factory, what he inspects etc. is known to you too. If statutes are enforecd with the spirit of making it; I am sure there will not be any industrial accident at all in India.

Even proper safety education is not provided here. The Post diploma in industrial safety is not the end. You can not make a safety officer with that curriculum. What they learn is not sufficient to shape a competent safety officer. You are right in that respect. Most safety officers require perfect training if they are to do justice to their calling.

Again HRM can not escape responsibility. They have absolute responsibility for choosing the right candidate for the post of S.Officer and for that matter for every post.

I am attaching an incomplete power point presentation with a request to all in the field to complete the presentation. Let us see where we stand. It may take about 25 slides to complete it.

Regards,

Kesava Pillai
26th November 2010 From India, Kollam

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@ Keshav Pillai
Dear Sir
I tried to go on adding something to the presentation... As you said it's about 25 slide to complete the presentation... Can you re-post the same with eadings, under which we suppose to do brain storming... Or else I don't think any one of in this forum even do a try...
Please give atleast the index upon which we can think further...
27th November 2010 From India
Dear All,

SHO is a statutory appointment He is 'mini-inspector" whose basic responsibility is to get the F.act implemented.In that sense he is representative of the Factory Inspectorate Still, the law do not require him to submit any confidential report which may give him opportunity to speak out. In some State rules he is not accorded any protection against management wrath if one is fulfilling his legal duty honestly. I knew one case where an SHO was asked to resign and leave. We invited SHOs and had several rounds of discussions to form Safety Professional Association with objective to safeguard interests of SHOs.We got it registered and campaigned with State Govt to provide protection to the SHOs. We presented memorandum to the concerned Minister when we called on him at his office.We also organized a seminar where we invited the then Lab Commissioner and presented the problems faced by SHOs. I was then working as Safety Officer with a Chemical Factory. There is clause of protection in Mode Rules but State Govt had not included. After our efforts Govt agreed and amended the Rules. Then I found that the SHOs are not much interested in organized efforts in safeguarding their interests not the Social interest.Association is defunct now. I hope that incidents like this where SHO is picked up by police and put behind bars-should once again generate interest in SHOs to get organized, discuss the problems and empower themselves

Jagdish Patel
28th November 2010 From India, Coimbatore
@ Kesava Sir ,
Thank you very much for explanation . I'll also try to complete presentation.
@ All Seniors ,
Is there any booklet or articles or special notes which guide safety & welfare officer to interprets all sections of factory act -1948 with examples ?
Regards,
Abhay
28th November 2010 From India, Mumbai
Dear Friends I want to share with you an interesting court case in Mauritius

The Case were lodged in 1999 and the Court judgement were in favour of the injured person

court case

Construction Company V/S INJURED EMPLOYEE (civil case) Source:Defiplus 05/8/2010

DAMAGED PAID TO INJURED PERSON IRS 1,000,000

Background

Accident occurred when the injured person were lifting a door with the help of a Co.Worker .He was knocked by the door and had to remove his testicular

Injured person version.Plaintiff

The Injured person belief that the company occurred because he was not given gloves and other equipments and adequate man power

Witness version

Witness belief that the accident occurred because there was no equipment and only two person were assigned the task of lifting a heavy door upstairs

COMPANY ARGUMENTS

The company argued that it was the duty of the main contractor ( the company was a sub-contrator on a construction site) on site to ensure safety of its employees and that a doctor witness for the company that the injured person already suffered from sterility

COURT JUDGEMENT
The Juge ruled that the company made proof of negligence by assigning the task only two two person instead of four

Moreso he fails to comply with the provisions of OSHA 2005 in respect of PPE and Risk Assessment

LESSON LEARNED( ( my OPinion)
No company is immune
To consider safety aspect before entering in contract
To ensure compliance with law in respect of Personal protective equipment
To consider health aspect at time of recruitment
To conduct risk assessment on tasks and site conditions
To put in place appropriate system of work
To provide appropriate training

I HAVE ANALYSE THIS CASE ON A PPT.UNFORTUNATE I FAIL TO UPLOAD SAME.CAN ANYONE HELP ME .

Regards
28th November 2010 From Mauritius, Vacoas
@Ajay Lachman
Dear Sir
You can easily upload files. Just try the following steps:
1. Click the manage attainents below the space where we are entering matter to post.
2. New window will open with browse option
3. Click browse and select file which you would like to upload. Remember the maximum file size will be 10mb and the supportive file type mentioned in the newly appear window itself.
4. Click uplodad after selecting file
5. After uploading close this window.
6. File is now attached. Type message. Click submit.
Hope this will help you in uploading files... If facing any further problems pls let me know.
28th November 2010 From India
@Keshav Pillai &Jagdish Patel
Dear Sir's
As per your opinion what a Safety Officer must do if his suggestions/recommendations not taken seriously by the company and not implementing the same...
Anything else than trying job in another company thinking of not getting self satisfaction from the job...
28th November 2010 From India
Dear all, Good inputs. I request all members to come forward with their valuble inputs. Srinivasa Rao. M
29th November 2010 From India, Calcutta
Dear Dipil,

What one will do if suggestions/recommendations are not accepted ?

Instead of having a general statement like this let us take few examples and analyze.

If you have, post a case from your experience with relevant details.

Majority of safety officers ask the same question too, but why ?

They get frustrated with this –but why ?

Most suggestions /recommendations if justifiable I can not see reason why it gets rejected. In few cases it for economic reasons. All other cases S.O. fails to provide justification, all the data required for decision making and so on.

My request is try to complete the power point presentation I have given in under this title on the previous page. A good reason for failures can be seen from it.

My advice to S.O. is - “never get frustrated and for this reason seek another employment.

Take it as a challenge. Get it implemented. You may ask how. It is an art. It is not easy but possible.

After getting ppt completed at least by one I will explain.

Regards,

Kesava Pillai
29th November 2010 From India, Kollam
@Keshav Pillai

Dear Sir

Thanks a lot for your input...

Again I am requesting you to give some idea on how to go ahead with the ppt... What all topics to consider... Just give your idea... Few headings please...

Now regarding not complying with the recommendation given... I will tell about one of my previous company...The work was well sinking... For that normally grab crane with grab bucket we were using... As and when the work progress one of the contractor brings a Winch Mounting arragement... The installtion was horrible... They use a wooden post of approx. 10 meter and another wooden piece as a projection... Then with the help of pulleys they make the arragement which help to lower the grab bucket... i hope you understand the situtaion...

My 1st recommendation was a grab crane instead of this...

Secondly I said i will accept this if anyone of you can produce a certificate of fitness of the entire arragement from a competant person...

Thirdly I said, if any of the above make done, I will not visit this particular site, and will not be responsible for any untowered happening...

Ultimately the third thing happened... The work get completed without any incident just because of the grace of God... Even the director of the company says me, it's not possible to deploy a crane... I also strictly say i will not go to this particular site and witness for something unsafe... he also agrees my condition, and for the mean time give me other assignment... I hope i tried my level best... But fails in get the things done...

Awaiting to hear from you...
29th November 2010 From India
Dear Dipil,
I am waiting for some one to try with ppt.
You are the onely one who made an attempt.
I am adding a few more slides.
You may better try and I am sure you can do it !
Regards,
Kesava Pillai
29th November 2010 From India, Kollam

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Dear Sir
I have added few data into the presentaion...
I know it's still un-complete... Looking froward to hear your comments about the addedd info...
Also awaiting to hear your comments, advice and the real intention behind bringing this for a discussion.
Thanks in advance.

30th November 2010 From India

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The role and RESPONSIBILITY of SHO would be

Advises and prepares Safety Improvement Plans for the year in consultation with the Apex

Safety Committee and General Works Manager

2. Checks and evaluates the effectiveness of the action taken or proposed to is taken to prevent

personal injuries

3. Coordinates and conducts all safety studies

4. Incorporates work permits / LOTO, wherever required, and monitors compliance against the

same

5. Advises the purchase and stores department in ensuring high quality and availability of

personal protective equipment

6. Advises and carries out plant safety inspections in order to observe the physical conditions of

work and the work practices and procedures followed by the workers and to render advice on

measures to is adopted for removing unsafe physical conditions and preventing unsafe

actions by workers

7. Prepares safety audit, safety inspection and safety training calendar schedules for the year

8. Renders matters related to reporting and investigation of industrial accidents and diseases to

inspectorate of factories.

Facilitates accident and dangerous occurrence investigation

10. Advises and maintains all records as are necessary relating to accidents, dangerous

occurrences and industrial diseases

11. Coordinates the departmental safety committee meetings and the Apex Safety Committee

Meetings in coordination with safety coordinators and safety representatives

12. Organizes in association with the concerned departments campaigns, competitions, contests

and other activities which will develop and maintain the interest of the workers in establishing

and maintaining safe conditions of work and procedures

13. Actively participates in the activities carried out regarding the safety in the concerned

industrial area.

14. Liaisons with certifying bodies and ensures reporting of statutory compliances to the General

Works Manager.

15. Ensures MSDS availability of all chemical used in the plant and to disseminate information to

all employees.

16. Updates all safety documents as per statutory requirements, or otherwise

17. Coordinates all amendment requests to the Asian Paints Safety Manual.

18. Audits fire fighting equipment, periodically, in coordination with the Senior Manager - Plant

Engineering and the Manager - Security. However primary responsibility of its upkeep is with

the Safety Officer. Monthly report of these checks is given to the General Works Manager by

the Safety Officer.

Safety Officer is never required or permitted to do any work which is inconsistent with or

detrimental to the performance of the duties mentioned above
30th November 2010 From India, Hyderabad
Dear Safety Professionals,



Please find below the news of recent fire/explosion occurred in chemical factory located at Nandesari, Vadodara district. The company was having ISO 9001/14001, OHSAS 18001 certifications??? The police have registered offence under IPC section 304 & arrested company’s safety/security officer.

The moral of the incident is: We all are safety professionals & many of us are deputed in factories hence we have to be very cautious & keep all our internal/external safety related communications like reporting unsafe act/conditions, statutory non-compliances etc. in written & always keep hard copies of such specific communications with us which can certainly help us if trapped in such situations. Under section 101 (Exemption of occupier or manager from liability in certain cases) of Factories Act, the occupier or manager can escape from the charges & held some one else responsible/actual offender (he can be a safety officer!!!) in the court.



Explosion in chemical factory: One killed, seven injured

Vadodara: A series of explosions at a chemical factory in the Gujarat Industrial Development Corporation (GIDC) premises at Nandesari killed one worker and injured seven others, including the plant supervisor, on Monday morning.

The mishap occurred at K-Dac Chemicals, owned by Vadodara businessman Laxmikant Gaud, at 5 am, when the night shift was about to end. The boiler contained synthetic aromatic chemicals and silica.

Plant supervisor Jatin Joshi said Jagadish Gohil from Fazalpur died in the second explosion while trying to close the valve near the boiler section after the first explosion had occurred. His body was flung several feet away killing him instantly. Seven others sustained injuries as the blast scattered glass in all directions.

"Thirty-five workers had just evacuated the premises after finishing work when the first explosion occurred. Gohil ran towards the boiler trying to switch off the valve and died in the second explosion. Some of our workers sustained injuries when glass flew in all directions from the boiler. The fire spread to the other parts quickly," said Joshi.

Four of the injured were from the neighbouring shed who were asleep at the time of the explosion. The injured workers have been admitted to the Shreeji Hospital near Chhani Jakatnaka in Vadodara.

Vadodara Municipal Corporation officials said seven fire tenders were rushed from Vadodara to douse the blaze.

"A 25-member squad was formed to tackle the fire. The presence of hazardous chemicals in the factory premises kept the blaze alive for four to five hours," said H J Taparia, Chief Fire Officer, VMC.

Vadodara Collector Vijay Nehra said the Joint Director of Department of Industrial Safety and Health and Vadodara police will investigate the accident. "We are not directly conducting any inquiry, but the joint director of industrial safety and health will submit the report to the Collector's office after investigating the cause of the blast. The Vadodara police will investigate the incident that led to the death of one worker," said Nehra.

According to the various government agencies, this was the fourth such accident at a chemical unit in Nandesari GIDC.

Assistant Commissioner of Police Rakesh Sharma said: "We have started the preliminary investigation on the cause of the fire, including the shift timings of the workers and the safety norms followed by the owners of the factory."

Kantibhai Gohil, brother of the deceased worker said workers in the unit dealt with hazardous chemicals like hydrogen peroxide without basic safety requirements. The company uses hazardous chemicals like hydrogen peroxide, DMS, acetic acid, caustic soda, Hydrochloric Acid, Sodium Bicarbonate and has 200 metric tonnes of production capacity for aromatic substances.

The factory inspectors have now issued a prohibitory order against K Dac Chemicals from setting up the plant again.

"We have issued the prohibitory orders against the company that before they set up the plant anywhere, they must file a safety report. To further ascertain the cause of the fire, our team will examine the site on Wednesday," said P M Shah, Factory Inspector, Department of Industrial Safety and Health.

Nandesari Industries Association President, Babubhai Patel said the association should be empowered to keep strict vigil on the plants for safety regulations.

"We always tell our member industries to follow the safety precautions while operating with hazardous chemicals. But we cannot stop anyone from manufacturing, as we do not have the authority to do anything," said Patel.

Source: The Indian Express/IANS

Regards,

Dilip kasar.
1st December 2010 From India, Pune
Dear Kesav sir,
I will try to post Todays safety officer PPT ASAP.I am not get time to prepare PPT.Hopefully i will come with my inputs (whether its right or wrong). . .
Dear Hari & dipil,
Thanks for ur inputs. . .
Thanks & Besafe
Raghu
8th December 2010 From United States, Fpo
Dear All,
Finaly what is the next step if a POLICE filed complaint against safety officer under 407A. Is he free to fight indipendantly or he has to step forward as guidance of management.
In case of Unsafe conditions to work - Fatal accident may or may not pointing safety officer's role
In case of Unsafe Action - FAtal Accident, safey officer not at all asked for his role. The executer under which the work executes is totaly responsible for the incident.
7th July 2013 From India, Anjar
#Anonymous
Respected seniors my Self Rakesh Pathak
i am giving safety training from last two yrs and now i want to open safety and security training academic .
i request please suggest me the ideas and advice for betterment
Regards
Rakesh Pathak
3rd February 2018 From India, Pune
Form the contribution of all the information gathered on 'A series of explosions at a chemical factory in the Gujarat Industrial Development Corporation (GIDC) premises at Nandesari' my contribution would be as follows:-
It should be the responsibility of the Management / Safety officer's procedure violation.
Did the Safety Health Officer or the Management , have, any written 'hazardous operation procedure' for this chemical pressure vessel plant?
Assuming there is one, procedure, what is the safe permit able pressure limit for this pressure vessel and how the pressure was being monitored / how often. Did the procedure was followed in practice on that day?
In the written procedure the safe thickness of the walls of the pressure vessel were checked? and how often? whether the procedure was followed in practice.
The safe period of life of any pressure vessel as assessed and certified by the Manufacturer/ Certified agency ( normally by a chemical engineer expert), is within the valid period or not.
Whether any operating / checking procedure were drafted, and was not followed / any violation by any workmen at the time of accident was noticed / witnesses by any body, at the time of accident.
All the procedure should have been accepted and is in practice. Some time only log entry will be there without proper checking. The Safety Officer / Line Managers / plant Managers have the responsibility / should have observed, whether the procedure was being followed as per procedure. This follow up is also as important as production.
If any of procedure violation / including the non availability of such procedure, Management as a team has to sit and decide, and draft a future to avoid recurrence?
10th February 2018 From India, Madras
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