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Thread Started by #f9773d4f2607a006d4f4c2901

hi i m niharika wrkng as an hr executive in a pharmaceutical company here sm higher rank employees comes late to the company, they says that if they can stay after wrkng hours in the evening then they can also come late in the mrng also. what shoud i do in this matter.
9th September 2009 From India, Shimla
hi niharika,
Normally an employee has to work for 9 hrs a day . Over and above 9 hrs if they are workin it is with thier work load or incomplete work they are stayin n it wont be counted as well. The management has to be clear on its policies related to these things.
9th September 2009
If your companies has flexible timings then it shoudnt be a concern...If they are maintaining average working hours that should be fine. If you are clear on Log in and Log out time then convey the same and tell them that they should be in office on time and need not stay back late unless it is very much required.
Regards,
9th September 2009 From India, Bangalore
If the high rank officials are logging stipulated hours per week as per your company policy and dont have any complains from their higher officials then you dont need to worry. :)
There can be some flexibility given to employees for their work life balance, but if you feel that they are setting a bad example to others then you can gently bring it to the management notice. The management will look into the issue more seriously as to what these people are spending time into a. meetings with overseas client b. work overload c. doing their personal work in office time e.t.c
9th September 2009 From United States, Winston Salem
Hi,
Try to have flexible timing in your organisation this will solve the purpose,if u dont have then u must have some policies framed with the consent of your senior person in HR which will help to control the situation.
10th September 2009 From India, Nagpur
If your companies have flexible timing you can apply same or ask them (better mail correspondence or any written statement) to follow company procedure on office timing. Nenju
10th September 2009 From United Arab Emirates, Dubai
Hi My Dear Friends, Can you send anybody form 23 it’s relaed to inspector of factories. Regards, Hareesh
10th September 2009 From India, Panipat
We have made a policy that three lates are allowed to employee in a month.More than three lates will be treated as half day CL and more than five lates will be treated as full day CL. Memoes are issued for lates more than five. This works.
Regards,
Sdd
10th September 2009 From India, Thana
niharika ji
Is there any standing orders in your company. if not then make it as earlier because rules r same for every catagary or class. And give a of this to every heigher class employees.
bharat kaushik
OM ASSOCIATES
10th September 2009 From India, Faridabad
I accept what Mr. amit has suggested. You need to take Management Views on Handling such situations. You can either have a fexible times or you can cut half day Cl In case of 3 late comings. But as you said that they are senior employees, management should address this issue as it is a delicate link.
10th September 2009
Hey,
Check with your management about the timings. Is that to be carried out for everyone. Then its very simple. You just have to get the confirmation from the top management in regards to the timings and then you shall implement the frame rule. Do check and let me know so that I shall help you with.
10th September 2009 From India, Bangalore
Dear,
An organization should have logging rules for in and out. So that we wont find any controvercies with any one. We are having smart card rules in our company for rectifying these problems.
Regards,
Selva Nathiya,
Management Executive

10th September 2009 From India, Madras

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Hi Niharika, Please call me . I have a lot of exposure in this. Madhu 9884173041 9176638999
10th September 2009 From India, Madras
Hi Niharika, If they are maintaining their daily work hours by staying back and working till late, then i dont think you have to do anything, as the productivity is not declining. BR Ramneet
10th September 2009 From India, Delhi
How contradictory that companies expect employees to be on time in the morning but dont care about timings in the evening. If the company wants its employees to follow policy then this is also a ploicy part not to stay after stipulated office timings.
Anyways...there are no harm in late coming as long as it is not harming the work. Prime concern should be the timely completion of work. If that doesnt suffer, then no one should be worried about this....
11th September 2009 From India, Ghaziabad
Some leeway is always given for senior officers; as their productivity is not based on hours of work (unlike piece-rated or time-rated workers); but rather on the decisions they take which has far-reaching implications for the company.
You must have noticed that seniors spend more time outside their offices - in meetings, conferences, tours etc. As a matter of fact, they are considered to be on duty 24x7. If something requires their attention, they can be reached anytime; and they in fact, give much more time than otherwise stipulated and have much more responsibilities thrust upon their shoulders. In the smallest possible time they have to take take decisions which cam make or mar a company.
For such people, the time spent inside the office is inconsequential. You need not be bothered about such things as it is well-known to the higher management. There are always exceptions to everything, and you should consider it as such.
Regards.
11th September 2009 From India, Delhi
Hi
See if your business requirement is demanding those employees to stay late in the evenings. And also see whether there deliverables/targets are met.
If every thing is ok then i don't think you need to impose them for timings.
An employee should always be given freedom to work. And organisation should be strict on deliverables/targets.
Because we will gain profits based on deliverables/targets but not on employee stay/timings in organisation or by maintaining timings.
Raghunath
11th September 2009 From Australia
Hi niharika,
i am also working in pharma company in himachal pradesh, we have constructed a late comming policy which is applicable to all level of employees.
Further, this is related to the discipline of the company and it can not be tolerated. If they are working in the late hrs it is because their nature of duty and work style, it does not means that they will come late too. Being hr deptt this is our responsibility to handle such cases with no difference.
Baljeet sahotra
manager hrm
11th September 2009 From India, Chandigarh
Normally, this kinid of issues are appearing in all organisations, however, you need to keep entry book at security level and do the analysis of each employee like what time they are coming and going. One fine day this analysis you may forward it to through your HR manager individually to all top members. At the begning this may cause or take personally by everyone but later they will understand the company policy and values..................take this issue in positive manner and adopt your system. still they are not changing their minds you may forward to Senior Management where they can monitor and act on these areas at smooth level.............just try in positive manner and good luck.............sridhar
11th September 2009 From India, New Delhi
hai,
this is venkat. in my view you have to do your job.doesn,t consider anyone whether he is a senior or junior. in my organization i am doing late coming deductions for even dgm also. go ahead do your job as per policy.
11th September 2009
Any Advisors coming late ask them to wear a funny cap and the whole day they will be roaming with the cap or hat...
11th September 2009 From China
Most of MNC's companies not much tolerate if their employees late in morning, especially for those sits late at evening & do their assignments on time.
All companies should follow "Work-Life-Balance" for thier employees.
regards
Rahul
11th September 2009 From Singapore
In my past company the same thing happened. It was noticed to CEO . Then he fixed time for normal workers 8.30 A.M to 5.00 PM ( first sift) . Then for Manager and executives 9.00 AM to 5.30. PM. For second i had not faced this problem. So you need to convince to your top management regrding this and fix time acordingly. For company has concerned timing is very IMP.
11th September 2009
Hi Niharika,
They days many of the companies are switching or already have switched their gears to "FLEXI WORK HRS", it all about the quality work rather than the man hours spent in office.
In case of Sr Managers/Officials, they have a different set of targets to achieve which often keeps them away from office.I guess your higher management would be aware of their work hours, so don't be so concerned.
11th September 2009 From India, Hyderabad
If your companies have flexible timing for seniours & doing atleast 8 hrs. duty then not bother it otherwise if your company has strict on timing & they come after 12.30 pm or 1.00 pm then you can mark half day as per company policy.

11th September 2009 From India, New Delhi
hi niharika,
you are treading on dangerous waters. first who brought this up? hr or management or are you trying to rein them in.
managements generally give senior people the option of flexi time (not in writing but implied). the seniormost person in hr/admin should bring it to the management's notice and take a call. as a hr executive may be you are trying to bring in uniformity.
middle level workers may have grumbled against this but you can't do much. any way if you want to go ahead go with recorded instances (should not be difficult) and have a back up job (for you if required)
11th September 2009 From India, Madras
Dear Niharika,
As you mentioned, this problem should have been taken seriously by you as well as sr. management. Because the logic they are giving is not realistic. They are staying back late hours for their job duties. It is their fault to not complete their work on time. They will have to come on time, which has fixed by management for all employees.
Thx
Rajesh Sharma
11th September 2009 From India, Delhi
Niharika ,
It depend on your company policy .if you have flexible timing then its fine or else you can take a mail from them regards to late coming as it would be easy for you during audit .
Or
If ratio is high .You can draft a policy for flexible timing…..with approval from your senior.
Regards,
Surjit Singh
11th September 2009 From India, Valsad
hi Niharika,
if the condition is like that then u can reply them to say , if u go late from the office it means u r dedicated to the company and if u come late it means u r not following the office protocol :) . i usually do it:icon10: .
warm regards
Deepak
11th September 2009 From India, Haridwar
Hi Niharika,

You can’t ask your seniors for any type of issues like late coming which should be asked by their departmental senior person coordination with respective of that level your hr person.
Here, you go through
1) Prepare a note details of name and designation of persons, no.of late coming and supporting document of their duty correction form (if available).
2) Send this note to your seniors clearly in writing ‘ please advice on this matters’.
3) Follow their advice. Because senior HR person always well versed with all HR related activities.

This is a proofed for you in future if any problem arises by those late coming employees.
:-P
11th September 2009 From India, Pune
hi Niharika
Regarding this there are two options in my opinion.
1. U talk to ur HOD to talk to the management regarding this and tell them to formulate a circular for requestingt the higher rank officials to enter timely.This way u also can understand the management's motive.
2. U can take the initiative to start flexi timing in ur org or when ur HOD would talk to management regarding the matter ask him to give this proposal of flexi timing to the management.
11th September 2009 From India, Calcutta
Though may companies have implemented flexi timings either on a daily basis or on weekly basis. One more idea to counter late coming is to propose Perfect attendance Bonus allowance (@ Rs.1000/-p.m) additional motivation for all employees to report punctual. Any deviation from punctuality would mean loss of said amount in that particular month.
11th September 2009 From India
hello niharika,
First you analyse why they are working late hours. If it is not necessary to work late hours, arrange a meeting and tell them straight a way. Before that you have to prepare a HR policy along with that people.
natarajan
Hi PrO Mananagement Consultants
11th September 2009 From India, Madras
Hi niharika,
The office timimg policy generally depends on the kind of industry you fall in.For example for media companies they allow employees to work in the flexi hours.If you do not have such policy (being a pharma company), probably you can deduct their PLs / CLs accordingly.In our company for every 3 late marks employee will loose their 1/2 PL and in case of zero PL balance there would a loss of pay.Try and implement this with the prior approval from your supervisor.
11th September 2009 From India, Mumbai
Hi everybody:)
pl guide me as am newly joined in a IT firm having around 30 contract/consultant employees. Wud any one help me regarding leave, intime and out time is particular for contract/consultant any information of IT HR
rgds
Divyanjali
11th September 2009 From India, Mangaluru
Hello Niharika,
I think the way to handle this issue could be by having Flexi timings with a time limit, May be reporting time can be between 0730 and 0930 and Closing time between 1600 and 1800. However total weekly working hrs prescribed by you company shall be met, If there is a need for further late coming or early going that could be with permission of their superiors.
Best Regards,
Dass.
11th September 2009 From Singapore
What is the the mind of the organisation? Does it feel that rules are very important & not to be compronised under any circumstances? alternatively does it think procedures don't matter much so long as expectations are delivered?There are no right or wrong answers.What the management seriously believes in everyone has to fall in line. So first find out the mind of the management. It doesn't really matter what niharika thinks or any member of this cite thinks. The key is what the management thinks. remember most of the senior officers comprise of the management. So if they dont believe in something, either you have to bring them along to to ur point of view with facts & justification or go along with the management view. Otherwise you would be a misfit fighting a losing battle. Ultimate aim remember, is the effective performance of the organisation & not ego trips of individuals.
Regards
Rationalraj
11th September 2009 From India, Bellary
Hi Niharika,
We often recieve such complaints. How we deal with this is -
The timings of an employee must be based on this jobs and what objectives he has to meet while doing that job. If a job has fixed TAT then yes the timings must be strict. But if it is not then we must only see whether he/she is able to complete the job within fixed Deadlines (defined). Keeping this in the mind some Executives are given the liberty to have a little flexibility in their timings, but we make sure that all such employees understand the importance of keeping their superiors & Team informed in advance if they are coming late.
Saurabh
Saurabh
11th September 2009 From China, Leizhou
This is not uncommon. A workplace cannot be run like a school at times. The senior mgrs, by default & by virtue of their roles, consider themselves to be special. In such instances, the HR person must be careful in presenting the rule book. The top management must also support the process. Invariably, the senior mgrs are exempted from such structured shift timings. If that is so in your case, you advised to take it easy as the mgt. finds it acceptable.
11th September 2009 From India, Hyderabad
Hi Niharika.........
It'a routine matter in any organisation. I will suggest you to
1) Prepare a incoming and outgoing entry to trace out the excat timing.
2) Prepare a policy specifically for late coming, wherein upto 3-4 latemarks of 1/2 hr each can be allowed to every employee. After than they will be charges 1/ LWP etc.
3) Make a policy for late night working staff. e.g. employee who works upto 9pm they will allowed to come late by 1 hour on next day. If upto 12pm then 2 hr like that.
4) Make a pre-sanction format for staying in office for late night work and reason for that duly approved by their respective D.H.
I think this will help you to manage such employees.
Regards,
Viju
11th September 2009 From India, Pune
there are no hard and fast rules. the general principle is

THE NECCESSITIES SHOULD FLOW DOWN TO UP AND THE DISCPLINE FROM UP O DOWN.

So it is for officers to set the standard in coming to office in time. Staying late or doing more than 9 hours work are all EXCUSES.

tHE HIGHER ranking oficers have to come in time to office. It is mental set up than the reasons. They gave to counselled for this appropriately.The perks and other benefits are all different the common employee. hence these things are also different. they should follow the rules.

In one of the Companyies where i worked, the Director and myself were only the people who come in time. we were appriciated by one and all.

True Example _ one of the companies the marketing Manager was also inchrage of HR for some time. He use to go outside with clients and come to factory after a drink or two. One day he asked an employee, who was drunk to go out of factory. The worker retorted by saying what is the differnce between them, u drink foreign and i drink country. the marketing manager waas shockesd. we have to be models in cases moral, character etc

nagaraj
11th September 2009 From India, Bangalore
Hi. If the company policy is clear on resumption time. This should then be made clear to d snr executive who are expected to lead by example. I believe d policy cuts across all cadre of staff. Exceptions should not be made to them as they likely approved d policy in d first place.
11th September 2009 From Nigeria
Hey, if these guys are putting in the required hours, it shouldnt be a problem. And if these guys are geeting away with it, then the chance of the Management being aware about this is quite high.
If you feel that others may follow suit which would hamper the working environment, then you can either tell the mgmt, the HODs and leave it for them to decide or put up a proposal for time management/ 'punching system'.
Hope it helps.
Rgds
11th September 2009 From India, Visakhapatnam
Punctuality is one of the vital pillars of general organisational discipline. This should not be flouted. If the organisation is not having a firm policy regarding flexi hours of work, some individuals enjoying the same is bound to irritate other employees and more so if the senior employees donot adhere to rules , they set bad example for others. The senior executives must lead by example and be good leaders. Further, overstaying unless warranted in extreme emergency should be viewed as inefficiency and employees must learn to complete their jobs in scheduled time. A course or training in Time Management would also help. Propagate the usefulness and importance of punctuality and the erring employees should be reprimanded unless they change their bad habits of late coming.
Be tactful and enforce this in the better interest of your organisation.

12th September 2009 From India, Calcutta
rules are made to follow , wether he is junior or senior, any one working beyond the normal working hours needs to look into his work culture and time management, staying over does not show efficency or loyality, may be he has other motives and problems too, the organisational head needs to look in to the matter.
12th September 2009 From India, Madras
Hi Niharika,
same prob we wr facing at our company....:icon7::(
Then we started daily monitoring of late comers...
and at the end of the month whole months data we use to send to concern HOD and GM...
and really works...
U can also try something like this if possible....
Deepa..
12th September 2009 From India, Mumbai
HR policies in an Organisation should be similar for everyone irrespective of their positions. There should not be any confusions in such cases. We all work with a common motive for an Organisation and hence the policies should be common for everyone. I understand that there are exceptions to few cases but the Office timings should be strictly followed by everyone. Not adhereing to the policies set by the Management is a misconduct. So, being a HR professional, it's we who has to keep a track and escalate such cases to the senior Management. Let the Sr. Management take a final call.
Correct me if I am wrong.
Regards,
Rachita
12th September 2009 From India, Pune
hi
to suceed punctuality is must, this is in the interest of any organisation, if they are going late shows that they are unable to manage time. Staying late is for covering their own incapability or for learning or to match incomplete goal that is theri headace.
if higher authorities are entering late their department functioning also may start late this will realy affect at large.
regards
abhijeet pawar
Mahindra Forgings Ltd
9822440053
12th September 2009 From India, Mumbai
Hi Niharika,

This is a universal issue faced by most of the Companies,to be very frank there is no proven solution for this because of the following reason

1. This activity is generally practicesed by those employees ,whose presence in the organisation is very important and he may be the key person or decision maker of there respective departments or section. Primiraly at lower level they are team leaders,group leaders ,A person with exceptional quality.

2.You must have or you may going to face a situation where you report of late coming to the higher management for a particular person and it will not be heard. If you will shout more about him or a group ,they will be just called by the higher authorities ,a warning at a frequency of six to nine months will be given to them, That is all. No strict action will be taken against them.

This generally happens everywhere and there is no way of eleminating especially ,those who are in the Technical sectioni.e Engineers,Foreman,chargeman,head,chief,etc.

I am telling you this is even tolerated in Company Like Tata Steel,TCE,Jindal,etc.

The Only way of reducing the no of late comings is by.

1. Once he or she comes late,you have to react immediately by showing a small anger or shouting in front of every body.
2.Advise your boss(helpless fellow,he cannot reduce late coming since the work has to be completed in time) that whenever he founds a mistake in the work of such employees those who have made a practice of late coming.While scruitinising his work in front of him ,he should always used the words like " Neither you complete your job in time nor you come to the office in time,you are a useless fellow".This formula actually works with most of the employee.

Actually the method stated above is doing the brain wash of such employees by embrassing him for such activity.

However if a human being is doing more then his commitement then his late coming can also be ignored.This i am telling you because some times back i was also a late comer for around 5 years after that i left the job started my own company and found the above method to be very productive

For my firm , i have made a formula of total no of wroking hours in a week.(Min 48,Max 56) So if somebody stays for a longer duration then that is adjusted with next days or we pay him for the duration extra if any.

I hope it may help you.

Regards,

Rahul Vijay

12th September 2009 From India, Ranchi
What do your HR Manager / General Manager HR / Vice President HR feel about this? If it is a high ranking manager who is unpunctual and if your senior officials do not feel any thing about it is better to keep quite and let your seniors handle it. Vivek Hattangadi
12th September 2009 From India, Ahmadabad

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