Dear Members,
I have a unique problem. One of my organization's employee was not performing for quite some time, he was on probation. he was given several verbal warnings on absenteeism, non performance, late comings etc, though unfortunately none was recorded as there was no HR in the company. After I came in I had issued him a warning letter stating a observation period of 15 days after which management can take a stand, the next day he did not report to work citing health reasons and then when he reported to office he said that he wanted to resign stating health reasons,he resigned stating unavoidable circumstances and it was duly accepted by the management provided he served 15 days notice period or pay in lieu thereof.
But on the same day itself when his handover process had just started and he was being questioned and reviewed about his work by the management, he suddenly threw a tantrum in front of the office stating that he did not feel like being in the company and he wanted to leave right then.
I told him in that case his resignation is no longer accepted and that since he is not serving notice period his 15 days salary will be deducted.
In his appointment letter it was mentioned that "15 days notice period or pay in lieu of from both ends", and "in case of insubordination or indiscipline termination without notice from the management's end".
now the question is- I and my management do not want me to issue any relieving or experience letter , in fact they would prefer a termination letter to be issued and 15 days amount to be deducted from his salary.Can this be feasible from a legal point of view?
Please suggest
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
I have a unique problem. One of my organization's employee was not performing for quite some time, he was on probation. he was given several verbal warnings on absenteeism, non performance, late comings etc, though unfortunately none was recorded as there was no HR in the company. After I came in I had issued him a warning letter stating a observation period of 15 days after which management can take a stand, the next day he did not report to work citing health reasons and then when he reported to office he said that he wanted to resign stating health reasons,he resigned stating unavoidable circumstances and it was duly accepted by the management provided he served 15 days notice period or pay in lieu thereof.
But on the same day itself when his handover process had just started and he was being questioned and reviewed about his work by the management, he suddenly threw a tantrum in front of the office stating that he did not feel like being in the company and he wanted to leave right then.
I told him in that case his resignation is no longer accepted and that since he is not serving notice period his 15 days salary will be deducted.
In his appointment letter it was mentioned that "15 days notice period or pay in lieu of from both ends", and "in case of insubordination or indiscipline termination without notice from the management's end".
now the question is- I and my management do not want me to issue any relieving or experience letter , in fact they would prefer a termination letter to be issued and 15 days amount to be deducted from his salary.Can this be feasible from a legal point of view?
Please suggest
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
Why do you want to issue a termination letter. Is it to pamper your management teams ego. Why are you finding it difficult to accept the fact that an employee is within his right not to work in an organisation because he does not like its work culture.
By terminating him, you will be making a mockery of yourself as he has already resigned. Please dont make it an ego issue and let it go.
From India, Calcutta
1By terminating him, you will be making a mockery of yourself as he has already resigned. Please dont make it an ego issue and let it go.
From India, Calcutta
Dear
i have gone through your complete case but i feel you and your management is taking the case in a egostic way.
One person whom you donot like and he is not performing and he has resigned himself than let him go.What you will gain by terminating him.The clause you have mentioned in your appointment letter is void abnitio means it is illegal.
Whatever tactics you are planning to adopt is not a healthy sign and individual can go to labour office and create problem
for you.let him go peacefully and you also stay peacefully.
From India, Delhi
i have gone through your complete case but i feel you and your management is taking the case in a egostic way.
One person whom you donot like and he is not performing and he has resigned himself than let him go.What you will gain by terminating him.The clause you have mentioned in your appointment letter is void abnitio means it is illegal.
Whatever tactics you are planning to adopt is not a healthy sign and individual can go to labour office and create problem
for you.let him go peacefully and you also stay peacefully.
From India, Delhi
As kaushik and malik suggested, it is nothing but waste of time to your management and you to keep such uninterested person in the organisation. Simply agree his resignation and settle him.
From India, Madras
From India, Madras
Even I was dubious about issuing a termination since that employee has already resigned, and hence this query.
But am I liable to provide a release letter, even though that person shouted and created a scene in the office when it was found out that there were a lot of discrepancies in his work and he was being asked to provide an explanation for the same so as to complete the handover process. This was when we had decided that we will accept his resignation and he will be provided the release.
But after openly insulting the senior management and walking out even though that person had been given a lot of chances before and even after his resignation was told that the management will end it on good terms, isn't a message being given to other employees, that an employee can not perform, be in-disciplined and even insult the management and still get away Scot-free.
I am thinking that "the person can be informed that his resignation is not accepted and since he has refused to serve the notice period his 15 days salary will be deducted and he will be provided salary as well as his form 16, though no release will be provided." Can this be feasible.
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
But am I liable to provide a release letter, even though that person shouted and created a scene in the office when it was found out that there were a lot of discrepancies in his work and he was being asked to provide an explanation for the same so as to complete the handover process. This was when we had decided that we will accept his resignation and he will be provided the release.
But after openly insulting the senior management and walking out even though that person had been given a lot of chances before and even after his resignation was told that the management will end it on good terms, isn't a message being given to other employees, that an employee can not perform, be in-disciplined and even insult the management and still get away Scot-free.
I am thinking that "the person can be informed that his resignation is not accepted and since he has refused to serve the notice period his 15 days salary will be deducted and he will be provided salary as well as his form 16, though no release will be provided." Can this be feasible.
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
Dear Members,
I have finally taken a decision and asked that person to resign mentioning that he was unwilling to serve the notice period as the earlier one he had mentioned that he will and then am going to accept the same. He has been informed that 15 days notice period will be deducted since he has refused to serve the same. he will be handed over the check and a F & F will be done from our end. after which I have told him that a release will be given and the form 16 as well.
I have asked him to apologize to the senior management but it has been stated clearly that its just a preference, and if he does not want to, we will still go ahead with the procedure as discussed.
I felt this was the most feasible way to ensure that management takes a stand and the person is dealt with properly as well.
Any Comments on the decision I have taken???
P.S. : in the person's release letter can it be kept to the point or do I need to mention something about his performance and conduct in the organization as well since I do not want to mention anything???
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
I have finally taken a decision and asked that person to resign mentioning that he was unwilling to serve the notice period as the earlier one he had mentioned that he will and then am going to accept the same. He has been informed that 15 days notice period will be deducted since he has refused to serve the same. he will be handed over the check and a F & F will be done from our end. after which I have told him that a release will be given and the form 16 as well.
I have asked him to apologize to the senior management but it has been stated clearly that its just a preference, and if he does not want to, we will still go ahead with the procedure as discussed.
I felt this was the most feasible way to ensure that management takes a stand and the person is dealt with properly as well.
Any Comments on the decision I have taken???
P.S. : in the person's release letter can it be kept to the point or do I need to mention something about his performance and conduct in the organization as well since I do not want to mention anything???
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
In you initial post you have stated that the concerned employee had resigned and that his resignation has been accepted provided he serves out the prescribed 15 days' Notice Period.
You have also stated that the concerned employee later threw a tantrum and wanted to leave immediately.
Now you are adding a new dimension to the matter...that you will ask him to resign etc...etc...
Please understand that an employee will only resign one and it is up to the management to deal with the situation thereafter. It should also not be forgotten that the employee cannot be forced to serve out the Notice Period. It is his right to decide otherwise and surrender salary lieu of the shortfall in the Notice Period.
Please be sure about the facts if the matter and the decide upon your course of action.
Try not to flex your muscles in forcing the employee to apologize etc.. in his new resignation letter. It lends a distasteful flavour to handling/managing people.
Vasant Nair
From India, Mumbai
You have also stated that the concerned employee later threw a tantrum and wanted to leave immediately.
Now you are adding a new dimension to the matter...that you will ask him to resign etc...etc...
Please understand that an employee will only resign one and it is up to the management to deal with the situation thereafter. It should also not be forgotten that the employee cannot be forced to serve out the Notice Period. It is his right to decide otherwise and surrender salary lieu of the shortfall in the Notice Period.
Please be sure about the facts if the matter and the decide upon your course of action.
Try not to flex your muscles in forcing the employee to apologize etc.. in his new resignation letter. It lends a distasteful flavour to handling/managing people.
Vasant Nair
From India, Mumbai
I agree with the posts.
If the employee has already resigned, he is not wanting to work for you.
If he doesn't want to serve his notice, you can recover it from his salary.
But terminating him on notice is funny... It is only reinforcing the status of the poor relation! But you may want to do that on your OWN account. Because if you terminate his notice, you are liable to pay for the rest of the duration. But if you are facing losses due to the conduct (like loss of sale, loss of customer image, etc.), then you might want to still go ahead.
Further, putting it in the certificate would be a difficult situation for the employee to deal with in future. It may not be worth it!
From United States, Daphne
If the employee has already resigned, he is not wanting to work for you.
If he doesn't want to serve his notice, you can recover it from his salary.
But terminating him on notice is funny... It is only reinforcing the status of the poor relation! But you may want to do that on your OWN account. Because if you terminate his notice, you are liable to pay for the rest of the duration. But if you are facing losses due to the conduct (like loss of sale, loss of customer image, etc.), then you might want to still go ahead.
Further, putting it in the certificate would be a difficult situation for the employee to deal with in future. It may not be worth it!
From United States, Daphne
thank you everyone for your valuable comments.
I guess the entire picture is not clear since there are a lot of facts that i have not mentioned since this problem was occurring for a long time, I have recently joined and faced this situation, wherein I have ensure that both sides were taken care of. Management and the employee.
first of all, the employee hasn't been terminated, since he has resigned though in his resignation letter he had mentioned a lot of things including that he will serve the notice period and he had gone on to mention to us that he was mentally unfit to work. We were pretty fine with it because anyways he was not performing and was absenting from duty on a regular basis.we accepted the resignation and the handover process was started on that day itself. when his work was being reviewed by his reporting head, it was revealed that there were a lot of discrepancies in the same and information was fraudulent. Upon being questioned he started shouting and insulting the head stormed out of the cabin went on the floors and started creating a huge scene.
After this the management was not fine with handing over the release and payment and they wanted me to find out a solution. I understand that if an employee has resigned once he shouldn't do it again, but in this case to salvage a lot of egos I went ahead and spoke to him one on one and told him to resign mentioning that he is unwilling to serve the notice period, and we will accept it as well as give his payment and release. He has agreed, the apology thing is just a preference, no hard and fast rule.
I felt this was the only way I could ensure that even the employee is not taken for a ride and neither is the management.
Since I have never faced such a situation before and being in the HR industry for just more than a year, I went viral on CiteHR since i do not have a Manager to fall back on.
So thank you for all your feedback , it actually helped me take a decision
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
I guess the entire picture is not clear since there are a lot of facts that i have not mentioned since this problem was occurring for a long time, I have recently joined and faced this situation, wherein I have ensure that both sides were taken care of. Management and the employee.
first of all, the employee hasn't been terminated, since he has resigned though in his resignation letter he had mentioned a lot of things including that he will serve the notice period and he had gone on to mention to us that he was mentally unfit to work. We were pretty fine with it because anyways he was not performing and was absenting from duty on a regular basis.we accepted the resignation and the handover process was started on that day itself. when his work was being reviewed by his reporting head, it was revealed that there were a lot of discrepancies in the same and information was fraudulent. Upon being questioned he started shouting and insulting the head stormed out of the cabin went on the floors and started creating a huge scene.
After this the management was not fine with handing over the release and payment and they wanted me to find out a solution. I understand that if an employee has resigned once he shouldn't do it again, but in this case to salvage a lot of egos I went ahead and spoke to him one on one and told him to resign mentioning that he is unwilling to serve the notice period, and we will accept it as well as give his payment and release. He has agreed, the apology thing is just a preference, no hard and fast rule.
I felt this was the only way I could ensure that even the employee is not taken for a ride and neither is the management.
Since I have never faced such a situation before and being in the HR industry for just more than a year, I went viral on CiteHR since i do not have a Manager to fall back on.
So thank you for all your feedback , it actually helped me take a decision
Regards.
From India, Calcutta
Now the decision has already been taken. So stay calm but I would just like to say that if in case, in future you encounter same situation then kindly don't even think of terminating an employee. HR is all about dealing and understanding employees, so try to observe and understand the behavior of the employee and then try to sort out the concerns of the employee. Termination is a very harsh act. It should only be taken when no other option is available.
From India, Mumbai
From India, Mumbai
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